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Dell Support Upgrade Helps Support Dell Support

By Ed Foster, Section The Gripelog
Posted on Thu Nov 08, 2007 at 12:54:17 AM PDT

Sometimes it seems like vendors are running their support operations purely as profit centers. That's certainly the impression one reader had after encountering some annoying problems with the Dell Support Center 2.0 software upgrade Dell pushed on him last week.


The reader wrote:

"I think Dell has found a new way to make money. Last Friday I received a Dell Support alert that I needed to upgrade my Dell Support Center to version 2.0 as all support for the old 1.0 version will end in the next few months. After I upgraded, every five minutes my work would be interrupted by a blank pop-up DOS screen, and every time I'd log on the Dell support folder would pop up on my screen."

"I called Dell tech support, which of course seems to be an overseas outsourced script-reading company. I described the problem. They asked me if I had an Internet connection. I said I did. To which they responded that my problem is most likely a virus. I explained to them that the problem only started happening immediately after I upgraded to Dell Support Center 2.0 and that if I disabled the service the problem disappeared. If I re-enabled the service the problem started again. To that the response was -- since my warranty expired about a month ago -- it would cost me $29.95 to continue the conversation."

"I opted not to pay the charge, to roll back my computer to the previous night prior to the upgrade, and to uninstall Dell Support Center 2.0. Seems to have undone most of the damage, although my Add/Remove programs refuses to uninstall the old Dell Support Center 1.0. And while it's true my hardware warranty may have expired a month ago, the software which I was alerted to install was only installed about a half hour earlier. I guess this is a good way for Dell to earn a little extra money -- have everyone install a buggy Support Center upgrade and then charge them all $29.95 when they call to report the problem."

Looking around the Internet, it appears that the reader isn't the only one who has had a problem with the Dell Support Center 2.0 upgrade. And the new feature that Dell most enthusiastically touts for the new version is its "proactive alerts." Is the message the reader got last week, warning of the dire consequences of not upgrading, just a sample of how proactive Dell is going to be? It's one thing for a vendor to take an aggressive approach to helping its customers, but it's quite another if the aggression is really aimed at drumming up business for its paid support.

Have you run into a company that sees supporting its products as a profit-making opportunity? Tell us about it by posting your comments below or by writing me at Foster@gripe2ed.com.
< Fair Use or Foul? | AT&T Fails to Communicate >


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Dell Support Upgrade Helps Support Dell Support | 25 comments (25 topical) | Post A Comment
Support is a profit center[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#1)
by Anonymous User on Fri Nov 09, 2007 at 07:38:43 AM PDT

Once the warranty runs out, companies DO make a profit on support. And producing quality products at least minimizes the loss during the warranty period. There is no comparison between the reliability of a computer today than a decade or two ago -- far fewer failures now. Of course, reducing the warranty period (an earlier gripe) helps, too.

It's well known that extended warranties are profitable for either the manufacturers or stores that sell them. And just having the contact with the customer after the sale gives opportunities for upsales later.

One thing you do point out -- you can usually find answers to problems by searching the Internet, and also by checking the company's online support forums. This almost always beats a phone call in saving time and money.



[ Reply to This ]


Are you nuts?[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#2)
by Anonymous User on Fri Nov 09, 2007 at 11:20:07 AM PDT

You must be smoking crack...
There is no comparison between the reliability of a computer today than a decade or two ago -- far fewer failures now.
PCs today are made using the lowest-cost parts from the lowest-cost source made by the lowest-cost people. IBM, Amstrad, Epson, Northgate, AST, Compaq, Dell, Gatweay 2000, even Tandy... Those guys knew how to make a well-made PC. Just think of how many IBM ATs, PS/2s, Compaq Deskpros, etc. would still work today if it wasn't for the fact that they're so obsolete. Packard Bell and Compaq (Presario) started this seemingly never-ending downward trend in terms of quality...

[ Parent | Reply to This ]


Not nuts and no drugs[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#3)
by Anonymous User on Fri Nov 09, 2007 at 03:31:09 PM PDT

I've bough nine computers in six years for my family and myself. Of those, a notebook required a new DVD drive and a desktop had a hard drive failure. A five year old system used as a server has been running 24/7 without any failure or crash. These have all been Dells or Macs. Computers I bought or used in 80's through the late 90's would be lucky to run a year without something going wrong. Hard drives would regularly get bad sectors and half the time floppy drives wouldn't work. I never had a system over a year old that didn't require replacing the fans (none of my current systems have ever had a fan replacement). Spontaneous reboots were common. Systems arriving DOA were common as it seemed that most manufacturers I dealt with apparently didn't have any quality control. You name it -- DOA motherboards, RAM, video cards, ports, hard drives with hundreds of bad sectors to map out (which had to be done by hand back then). In a classroom equipted with new computers (20 systems) in the mid 90's, every one had a CD drive failure within months of installation. These were name brand systems. I've had failures back then with IBM, Gateway, Everex, Intel, Acer, and custom build "white box" systems using name brand components.

I'd never go back!

[ Parent | Reply to This ]


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[ Parent | Reply to This ]


Yes, but...[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#4)
by BobS on Tue Nov 13, 2007 at 11:49:29 AM PDT

There is a big difference here between hardware support and what Dell did.

Dell told users -- all users, not just those whose hardware was still under warrenty -- that they must update a Dell written software product.

It would seem to me that if they do this they should, at the very least, either support that software upgrade for a reasonable amount of time or inform users of systems whose hardware is out of warrenty that the software will not be supported on that system.

This could very easily have been done since Dell Support Center (the one being updated) knows exactly what computer and what warrenty status the the upgrade notice is being sent to.

[ Parent | Reply to This ]



yes[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#29)
by maderikapapa on Sat Jun 28, 2008 at 01:01:12 AM PDT

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drgsdg[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#36)
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[ Parent | Reply to This ]


Dell support[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#5)
by Anonymous User on Tue Nov 13, 2007 at 12:29:36 PM PDT

I have used the dell support on my XPS laptops, 3 times for daughters, for an intermittant Headphone rx audio, they replaced the MotherBoard! Now We have been having Display problems. I tried to tell them it had to be the motherboard, but no, they had to replace the Hard drive, the 17" LCD, and the Graphics card. Now 1 Week later, the Display still goes out. Now they are going to replace the graphics card and display again. Now we will see what happens. I have been an Electronic Technician for 40 years, and know if a problem starts happening after a maintenance action, you look at what was done previously. I build my own desktops, and they are still working! But then I do use quality name brand and they have been reliable.

[ Parent | Reply to This ]


Paying for support?[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#6)
by Anonymous User on Tue Nov 13, 2007 at 01:01:58 PM PDT

"Have you run into a company that sees supporting its products as a profit-making opportunity? Tell us about it by posting your comments on my website or by writing me at Foster@gripe2ed.com." - this is rhetorical right Ed? Of course we all know of companies that make a profit supporting their products.. tiny little ones like Apple and Microsoft. While the person who wrote you seemed upset that Dell wasn't going to provide free support on a free upgrade they provided for an out-of-warranty system.. how would one expect them to recover the cost involved with supplying support. I remember when the gold-standard for support was Word Perfect Corp. They sold most of their product based on the great and FREE support they provided. They even provided support for people who stole their software. Look what happened to Word Perfect.. they found the cost of support exceeded the gains found by providing it for free - and started charging. That was the end of the company since their software was by that time not the superior product. It's not unreasonable for a company that is providing a service to expect to make a profit on providing the service - even if it's support. That gives them an incentive to provide support people WILL pay to use - and discourage the casual user from calling every time a pixel on the screen changes color. As has been mentioned - the Internet is the first line of support - and doesn't cost anything for those who feel support should be free. Of course sometimes you DO get what you pay for.

[ Reply to This ]


Support built into the cost[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#7)
by Anonymous User on Tue Nov 13, 2007 at 01:31:35 PM PDT

It wasn't that WP offered free support, it's that the basic support costs were built into the purchase price. Now that margins are supposedly razor-thin, the support costs are no longer as bundled. That's also why good warranty support is so hard to get; it comes out of the razor thin margins. Every opportunity is made to upsell to higher tier of service at additional cost. Extended warranties are the perfect example, and even those are usually not worth the paper they're written on.

[ Parent | Reply to This ]


Yes but...[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#8)
by BobS on Tue Nov 13, 2007 at 01:42:43 PM PDT

I think the point here is how Dell announced this upgrade ... that is by sending an upgrade notice to all Dell users that the upgrade was required. In fact the notice actually said that if the user didn't perform the upgrade within 2 months that Dell would automatically do the upgrade.

So Dell was saying the upgrade is going to be installed whether you want it or not, whether your hardware is under warrenty or not, and if not under warenty you must pay when the upgrade doesn't work.

I don't know, something just doesn't sound right about that.

Of course it appears the best action would have been for everyone whose warrenty was out to uninstall version 1.0 of the software and thus prevent the automatic update to the buggy version 2.0 from happening.

[ Parent | Reply to This ]



Rewriting history?[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#10)
by ricegf on Fri Nov 16, 2007 at 06:20:45 AM PDT

Word Perfect did NOT run into problems because of their technical support excellence and / or costs - they ran into problems because they invested big-time in a new graphical product for the operating system Microsoft touted as the future - no, OS/2 - while Microsoft was busily writing a competing product using secret programming interfaces for their real operating system of the future - right, Windows.

Microsoft then cut bundling deals with OEMS, so that customers would get Word for "free".

Once MS Word stole a large part of Word Perfect's market share through bundling, Word Perfect was acquired by Corel. Then Corel tossed the technical support for which Word Perfect was so famous, but only so that they could lower the price to try to compete with Microsoft's bundling strategy (a strategy that led, by the way, to their conviction for monopolistic practices).

I'm old enough to remember it well, but don't take my word for it (pun intended). Read all about it here and here.

Your point (which I believe is that free tech support isn't a viable long-term business strategy) may or may not be correct, but this isn't the case history to prove it. :-)


----- George F. Rice It is better to copy success than to invent mediocrity.
[ Parent | Reply to This ]


The Real Story[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#11)
by Anonymous User on Fri Nov 16, 2007 at 01:19:07 PM PDT

Having been a beta tester of the original WordPerfect product when the entire company was three people and WordPerfect had the name SSI (Satellite Software International), I have been tracking this product for many years. WordPerfect indeed ran into trouble when it did not move quickly into the Windows environment. They had plenty of time to respond to it but chose not to for whatever reason they may have had. Their top two owners (49.5% ownership each) had cultural differences from each other which distracted them from paying attention to the future of the product at that time. They parted ways by selling the WordPerfect organization, not to Corel but to Novell for about $700 million. WordPerfect's legendary support had begun to decline prior to that sale.

I live within 10 minutes walking distance from the old WordPerfect campus. I visited them several times with laptop in hand to demonstrate serious deficiencies in their then active Windows offering. By that time, many of their programmers and support people had been fired (some my close friends) and most offices were empty with the lights off. Meeting with a top level support person and a programmer manager, their response to me was that not enough people were reporting the problems I clearly demonstrated to move that bug to the top of the fix list. That was well over 10 years ago.

Since that time, Novell sold the WordPerfect products to Corel except for Groupwise, which was the only WordPerfect product they were really interested in. While Novell owned WordPerfect, they did almost nothing with developing anything for the product. Corel has improved on WordPerfect but HAS NEVER ADDRESSED the problems I brought to them years ago and which problems persist. More recently, Corel published WordPerfect 10 which broke the font handling engine in WP11, WP12, and WP13(X3) which worked properly in WP9. (I have to have both WP9 to get my work done and WPLatest loaded on my computer to access the latest features). They acknowledge the problem having discussed the font handling problem with them using phone, FAX and e-mail. They refuse to fix the problem or even commit to ever addressing the problem.

I continue to be a WordPerfect user. I also use MS Word. MS Word cannot hold a candle to WordPerfect for the sophisticated user. If one wants to write simple letters or reports, WordPad is fine enough and is totally free from Microsoft. That is the great Microsoft secret. Word has great deficiencies and significant design mistakes. WordPerfect is without equal even with all its flaws.

WordPerfect really only needs to do two things: 1. Fix the existing and long standing problems and 2. Publish the Linux version of WordPerfect that has already been done for many years and is just sitting on the shelf. One can only guess why Corel has not chosen to distribute the Linux version. Perhaps the fact that Microsoft at one time pumped millions into Corel at one of their hard times may have something to do with it. Perhaps the fact that a San Francisco venture capitalist with Microsoft ties has bought all outstanding shares the entire Corel company for under $100 million with the intent of reissuing the stock may have something to do with the non-Linux distribution as well.

One could conclude that Microsoft wants enough of WordPerfect around so that complaints of monopolistic practices are mitigated. Whatever, WordPerfect is an obvious killer application for Linux but is apparently not going to see the light of day.

Do I have a gripe? Absolutely! I have learned that greed rules.

[ Parent | Reply to This ]



I miss WP too[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#12)
by ricegf on Fri Nov 16, 2007 at 08:40:12 PM PDT

I thought Word Perfect's stream-based formatting was far superior to MS Word and OOo Writer's bizarre object-based formatting - where deleting a word at the end of a paragraph can suddenly reformat the previous paragraph, or maybe the next paragraph, or maybe cause an inline picture to jump above the top margin.

Word Perfect formats logically, like HTML. "Reveal Codes" actually revealed something useful, and I could understand my document. I miss that.

If Corel would release Word Perfect for Linux under a FOSS license, I'd switch back in a heartbeat. And if they offered a yearly subscription price for their old, great tech support, I'd pay for that, too.

I wish...


----- George F. Rice It is better to copy success than to invent mediocrity.
[ Parent | Reply to This ]


WordPerfect DOS Document Compatibility[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#13)
by Anonymous User on Sat Nov 17, 2007 at 12:01:15 AM PDT

I would have thought that WordPerfect  would have made its Windows versions 100% compatible with DOS 5.1 documents from the beginning.

Twice I have tried using DOS 5.1 documents with Windows WP 12 only to discover irresolvable incompatibilties.

It's little wonder that nearly 15 years after it was last updated, many users continue to use WordPerfect 5.1 and boast that it still beats everything else.

[ Parent | Reply to This ]



Dell Support[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#9)
by Anonymous User on Wed Nov 14, 2007 at 06:17:59 AM PDT

I've always uninstalled the crappy Dell "Support" applets that run in the background. They are of little help, and this case in point, causes more problems than assistance. Use Google or support.dell.com for PC issues / firmware upgrades.

[ Reply to This ]


1 link spam deleted[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#14)
by sconeu on Mon Jan 28, 2008 at 08:20:57 AM PDT

n/t

--
I am not merely a "consumer" or a "taxpayer". I am a Citizen of the United States of America.
[ Reply to This ]



lingering[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#27)
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kimo[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#28)
by Anonymous User on Thu Jun 26, 2008 at 12:30:17 AM PDT

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[ Reply to This ]


trmow[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#30)
by Anonymous User on Wed Jul 30, 2008 at 03:36:16 AM PDT

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deai[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#31)
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m[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#32)
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Great Article[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#33)
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