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Reader Voices: White Box PCs

By Ed Foster, Section The Gripelog
Posted on Tue Sep 13, 2005 at 12:31:58 AM PDT

Are "white box" computers the answer? Whenever we discuss problems with one of the major PC manufacturers, such as in our recent Dell and Alienware stories, it's for sure some readers will champion the use of no-name desktops from one's local resellers. But how viable an alternative to the name brands are the white boxes?


"It is no longer a matter of competition with superior products or services in the industry for your dollar," wrote one reader in reference to the major manufacturers. "It is about who can provide the least and get away with the most without being sued for raping Joe Customer. I quit buying Gateway products years ago, and I am surprised to see people still haven't learned. Support your local economy and community! You can get better products and service for about the same or less from your local neighborhood white box/clone computer store. This is my way of giving the finger to those long distance usurer corporate bastards and showing them there are other alternatives!"

White box aficionados say the real advantage is the support you get from a local supplier. "The IBMs and HPs claim they are now in the service business, but the neighborhood resellers are the ones who are really service oriented," another reader wrote. "They don't survive if they don't build a loyal following of repeat customers ... And while their service technicians may still speak with an accent, at least you know they're not trying to diagnose your machine from India."

But not all have found local vendor support to be exemplary. "About six years ago, I bought a computer from a local white box store," wrote another reader. "Several friends had purchased from them in the proceeding six months and were highly enthused about the results. Well, not only did they screw up the computer, but it took about five times of going through wipe/reinstall routines for me to realize that they were installing Zip disk drivers on a Win98SE box -- which did not need the drivers. Once I saw this and convinced them to stop installing the drivers, the computer purred. After that, I started building my own computers. I realize this is not an option for everyone, but at least if it is totally screwed up, I know who to blame and who will fix it."

In some localities, at least, the white box breed looks to be threatened with extinction. "Almost all of our local white box stores are gone," wrote another reader. "That's why I would hesitate even if I would get one from them; if they fold in six or twelve months because they couldn't take the heat from BestBuy, who's going to pick up the service? Fortunately the best one here contracted with a company out of town to provide some service to machines, although it wasn't nearly up to the level of before. Others just disappeared, one with a lot of clients' money, hardware, and data. But I heard the owner of that place was cooking the books for a long time. Making them from scratch is a frustrating endeavor sometimes, and not worth the money savings with the time it takes. I guess it's just not a winning situation right now."

But some suspect that another reason the local resellers days are numbered is that Microsoft's "Genuine Windows" activation and validation programs are designed to eliminate them. "In order for effective DRM to be implemented, it will have to have motherboard/BIOS support," theorized one reader. "If you want everyone to use compliant motherboards, you force them to the big OEM'S who are quietly installing whatever Microsoft tells them to. Then you get rid of the white box guys. You fix it so XP eats the registry every so often on the white box, and the customer has to reload the OS. The white box is a real pain because of product registration. The whole time the Microsoft employee is asking the customer if they bought from a legit dealer, insinuating that the dealer must be a crook, look at the junk machine and pirated OS he sold you. So, the world buys HP/DELL and ... the only people running non-compliant motherboards will be Linux folks, those evil un-American GPL'ers."

There's a certain irony to that, since one factor motivating some of us in the past to buy from white box vendors was to get a genuine, full-fledged Windows CD rather than just recovery files. "HP does not provide Windows CDs but some form of 'recovery disk' that blindly re-images your hard drive, thus erasing all programs added since the machine was purchased, and all documents, pictures, music, etc.," wrote another reader. "By the way, HP has been sued for this and has agreed to remedies. I keep finding out new ways that I have been screwed by this approach: no value-add directory, no recovery console, questionable licensing, etc. I will not buy another PC without a real Windows CD. If that means I need to buy a white box PC instead of the brand name provider, so be it."

So how viable an alternative do you think white box PCs are going to be in the future? Post your comments below or write me at Foster@gripe2ed.com.

< Sprinting To Hold On To Customers | Value From Microsoft Licensing Remains a Distant Vista >


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Reader Voices: White Box PCs | 287 comments (287 topical) | Post A Comment
Build your own?[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#1)
by Jim Blog on Tue Sep 13, 2005 at 05:10:54 AM PDT

Building your own PC is great fun - and really not too difficult so long as you know which end of the screwdriver to hold, and have the seven-joined fingers that the case manufacturers seem to assume... the only problem is when something goes wrong you and I probably don't have the skill and equipment to diagnose the problem. Is it the memory, the motherboard, the CPU? Who's to know? So if you're not lucky you're left with an expensive pile of useless carbon fibre and silicon, and nowhere to turn for help.

It's scary, reading stories like this, and makes me wonder what I'd do if I ever needed a new machine. Whichever way you turn, it's a lottery - there are no guaranteed happy endings. I just keep my fingers crossed I can keep upgrading my PC piecemeal until the day comes when we all have microchips in our heads.

The quote in the second paragraph is right on the money: "It is about who can provide the least and get away with the most without being sued for raping Joe Customer". It's a despressing world we live in.

[ Reply to This ]



You bet![ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#3)
by ricke on Tue Sep 13, 2005 at 06:00:04 AM PDT

How is that different from the 'support' you'd get from HP, Dell or Gateway? I've been building my own PC's for the last decade and I've had fewer problems than my friends who've bought brand-name boxes stuffed with the cheapest possible components. At least I'm the one making the tradeoff between components, not some accountant trying to squeeze another 10 cents out of the unit cost for the computer. These days tech support from the major PC manufacturers is a joke, even when you manage to get someone who appears to know what they're talking about.

[ Parent | Reply to This ]


not necessarily[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#7)
by Anonymous User on Tue Sep 13, 2005 at 02:19:02 PM PDT

Personally, I think it's all about fear. A computer is a very simple device. It is only complicated when you open up the case and see the unknown before you. We are not trapped. I learned everything I know by building and maintaining my own PC's. Sure, I have frustrations along the way, but at least I am in control of them. Surely this is no more frustrating then the stories told here. Granted, some problems will require the services of an expert. Conversely, at my work we use brand name boxes simply to ensure standardization, for many of the same reasons expressed already.

[ Parent | Reply to This ]


Not great either way.[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#12)
by foxyshadis1 on Tue Sep 13, 2005 at 06:19:10 PM PDT

I have all the equipment in the world to diagnose and fix problems, my company just doesn't want me spending the time putting 10-20 computers together every month, then install the OS, as well as the time and cost to pick out, order, and ship the parts. Personally I think we would about break even, although we'd also have to keep track of what parts are in each, who we got it from, who to call, how to find replacement parts later, etc. Not that dell ever knows what deal of the week is in their own machines anyway.

Given we're a terminal server shop, it's insane to buy craptacular dell P4s; I could put together cheap, stable, and silent & cold machines for less, and it's a suggestion I've made several times. (Along with those mini-integrated boxes.)

Custom gamer retailers who'll build a box for you might be viable alternatives, especially if you can get a discount for a large order out of one. I ordered an X2 from cyberpowersystem.com for a client, and got even more customizability than any OEM, for a great price. They contract for local service with the same people Dell does.

(Cool, I ended up in one of Ed's articles. =D)

[ Parent | Reply to This ]



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SOHO vs. Corporate[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#2)
by Fushigi on Tue Sep 13, 2005 at 05:56:44 AM PDT

There are two distinct sides to this. There are the small, single-location customers (homes and SMBs) who have an installed base of 1-300ish machines, and then there are the larger companies with multiple locations, potentially in multiple states and/or countries. For the SOHO company, a trusted white box supplier is reasonable. The local relation ship can be good for everyone.

For an enterprise, however, white-boxing really isn't feasable. My employer, for instance, is located in most states in the US and something like 17 countries around the globe. 17,000 people and probably around 12K PCs (laptops/desktop) + hundreds of servers. For us, vendor management would be overwhelming complicated if we had to deal with hundres of local shops for both procurement and for service. Finding new outlets if a store folds, varying levels of support, uneven pricing, are all real concerns. Far easier for us to pick one or two suppliers in each country or even just a single global supplier and manage that one relationship. Size brings a fair degree of leverage when it comes to servicing. We also gain support & administration advantages since we are standardized on single images for each machine type. There is also less concern over odd compatability problems since people will be using a standard software image on standard hardware.

[ Reply to This ]



There are clone shops that can handle it.[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#30)
by Reziac on Tue Sep 20, 2005 at 02:48:15 PM PDT

There are clone shops, some big enough to be minor retail chains in their own right (frex, PC Club) that can handle white-box orders of 1000 to 10,000 machines.
~REZ~
[ Parent | Reply to This ]


pasing[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#44)
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