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Dell's SC Return Policy

By Ed Foster, Section The Gripelog
Posted on Mon Jan 24, 2005 at 12:12:27 AM PDT

As if we didn't already have too much fine print from the software vendors, now it looks like we've got to read the hardware vendors' terms as well. At least that's what one reader discovered when he tried to return a Dell server that wouldn't work properly with his Linux application.


"I recently ordered a PowerEdge SC420 server from Dell," the reader wrote. "I ordered it with an SATA Raid array and ordered the second drive from Dell to make sure it would work with the first drive. They said it came with software to assist in loading the server system. Unfortunately, even though it does not warn of this limitation on the on-line order system, this software does not support any Linux installation -- not even the Red Hat products Dell sells. When it arrived, I tried to load my server software on it, which happens to be a Linux-based product. I actually tried three different products and each one said there were no hard drives."

The reader called Dell's legendary support, with predictable results. "I called Dell for support and they said I had to find a driver, but they could not really tell me how to find one or make it work," the reader wrote. "They also suggested disabling the Raid. I tried that and was able to load the SUSE Linux system, but it still isn't working as it should. Not being a full-time computer person, it took me a total of four weeks to try everything they suggested and everything I could think of. It still did not work as desired."

The reader had been laboring under the assumption he had 30 days to return the product, as is the case with most Dell servers. "I called for a return, and they said since it is the 'SC' series of the PowerEdge servers it only has a 14-day return period," he wrote. "The only exception made for that period is if they made a mistake, which is not possible with an on-line order. I was within the 30-day period which applies to almost all of their other servers. Do you think they know these servers have problems and have therefore shortened the period of time for return?"

What the reader had missed was a sentence in one of several long documents on Dell's website that talks about return policies. It reads:

New PowerEdge, PowerConnect and PowerVault products may be returned within thirty (30) days from the date on the packing slip or invoice except that new PowerEdge SC servers and n series products purchased from the Small and Medium Business Sales Division may only be returned within fourteen (14) days from the date on the packing slip or invoice.

"It was deep in the second layer of terms and conditions that this information is found," the reader wrote. "But it is there if you read all of the sections that talk about returns. This is really the first bad experience I've had with Dell, but they are not likely to get any more of my business. Fortunately I did not order a particularly expensive product so I should be able to make some use of it -- probably by pulling out their controller card and putting in something good, but it is irritating."

< NPF Headaches | Terms of Embarrassment >


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Dell's SC Return Policy | 28 comments (28 topical) | Post A Comment
Why Dell?[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#1)
by Anonymous User on Mon Jan 24, 2005 at 10:06:52 AM PDT

Dell is the last place I would go for a Linux server. Try a company that does this for a living, like Penguin Computing. I've purchased from them and recommended them to many SMB and even large corporations. They have always been excellent, both in the quality and compatibility of their hardware and their support.

Mace Moneta

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Penguin Computing[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#17)
by Anonymous User on Wed Feb 02, 2005 at 11:41:13 AM PDT

One more vote for Penguin Computing! They are excelent to work with. I've never had a problem that they couldn't work out. Great hardware and great support. This company, that has to be 1/10 the size of Dell, has better tech support and more reliable computers. Give them your business instead.

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A trend[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#2)
by mmburkes on Mon Jan 24, 2005 at 10:39:21 AM PDT

This is just part of the ever-increasing trend of drastically cutting service & support for low-end machines. Look at how many of Dell's machines now only come with 90-day warranties, for example. These SC servers in particular are the type you often see featured on sites like Techbargains, where through a combination of coupons or special offers you get the server for like $350. I imagine they are loss leaders for Dell, but it sounds like they want to have their cake and eat it too by generating sales with cheap machines but not supporting those sales. I don't personally agree that Dell should limit the return period to 14 days -- it's just too little time to set up the server and discover incompatibilities. Plus, paying a low price doesn't mean a customer should potentially get shafted for an honest ordering mistake.

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cd-rom[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#4)
by Anonymous User on Mon Jan 24, 2005 at 01:21:31 PM PDT

I bought a new Dell computer for xmas with a two year home warranty. The cd-rom did not work when I booted up. I contacted Dell support which transferred me to India where I then had to help train thier India technician to troubleshoot the issue. After 4 hours of being troubleshooting and being put on hold to "speak with his manager" he finally tells me that the cd-rom is broken. I said great send me a new one. His manager gets on on the phone and tell me that since I broke the cd-rom that Dell will not cover the replacement. How could I have broken it since it never worked. Luckily I called back and got someone else and they placed an rma order. Boy did I dodge that one at the last moment. Dell is starting to cut, cut and cut. Soon I will be buing my computers directly from China.

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Go with what you know[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#5)
by Anonymous User on Mon Jan 24, 2005 at 01:40:01 PM PDT

I just assume now that no manufacturer will ever help you fix any problem with their hardware--you must be able to do it yourself or build in the cost of hiring someone to fix it for you. Dell is the leader in "discouragement techniques"--their "help desk" is clearly designed to make you give up on getting any help and go find another way to fix your problem. I used to think it was just another way of trying to cut costs by using 3rd world non-English-speaking tech support, but it is now clear that this is an integral part of their business plan--if everyone quits trying to call tech support, there's no need for any tech support at all!

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Dell support[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#6)
by auctionhugh on Tue Jan 25, 2005 at 09:57:24 AM PDT

I find that if I call dell support during the daytime hours on a not-busy-day I get to talk to a USA human most of the time. If I get india I hang up and try again later. Yes this is frustrating but no doubt that is part of why dell can sell decent systems for less than you can build them yourself.

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Decent?[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#14)
by Mason on Tue Jan 25, 2005 at 11:20:03 PM PDT

If they were that decent, you wouldn't be needing to call support!

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14-day return policy[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#7)
by Anonymous User on Tue Jan 25, 2005 at 10:27:51 AM PDT

That's a simple one to solve! Just pay with a credit card, if they don't accept a return just reverse the charges.

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Quick fix[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#3)
by Anonymous User on Mon Jan 24, 2005 at 10:48:41 AM PDT

If you can replace the controller, use one from 3Ware (9500 series). They're true hardware RAID (no matter how/what you boot with the operating system sees one physical disk per array), and I've had no trouble using them with Linux and *BSD.

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Dell Problem?[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#8)
by Anonymous User on Tue Jan 25, 2005 at 11:14:20 AM PDT

Re: Dell's SC Return Policy This doesn't sound like a Dell problem to me. In the case of Linux, you get what you pay for. Why should Dell be under any obligation to support a roll-your-own operating system? Linux has some nice features, but guaranteed support is not among those features. Someone who is not a "full-time computer person" probably should not be messing around with Linux. I suspect the amount of money this person thought they were saving with Linux was more than lost by the time they spent trying to make it work. If they don't know where to look for a device driver, then an obvious solution would be to buy a Linux support contract from an established software services vendor; but don't blame your hardware vendor.

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re: Dell Problem?[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#10)
by Anonymous User on Tue Jan 25, 2005 at 12:52:03 PM PDT

Agreed! Linux/RAID -- Good Luck. The hardware was designed with Wintel in mind. Dell should only be held responsible, if the purchaser made the purchase with a live representative and told them the intentions of Linux/RAID BEFORE the purchase. Sounds as if the purchaser failed to do any homework regarding RAID, Dell, and Linux, in a single box. I have installed this exact box with Windows Server 2003 using Mirrored drives. Amazingly, today, I got a call that 1 of the drives (SATA) failed. Logs confirmed it and the sounds from the unit prove it. Called Dell, and within 1/2 hour, all was done and they are sending a replacement drive to the customer's site. I will see it tommorrow and install it. Services was as expected, Great! And No, I don't blame Dell for the drive failure. I wonder how long other vendors would have spent on line or the phone with this problem (Linux/RAID). My experience is that even the best of vendors, besides Dell, would have simply hung up after realizing the problem is not truely hardware related. (That is, a failed component.) I think Dell should be given high marks for going above and beyond the call of duty, trying to make a user supplied OS work on their hardware. As for the 14-day limit -- Well, margins are small and getting smaller. Especially on the lowest end of the product lines. Competative pressures always push the low end products down a quality control vs. price point curve. Something has to give. It's pure economics. As I recall, at a higher cost, a better warranty is available. But that only helps Supported software and Failed components.

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You obviously didn't read the article.[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#11)
by RonHack on Tue Jan 25, 2005 at 12:55:28 PM PDT

If you bothered to read, you will note that they DO supply Linux for their systems (in this case, Red Hat). The fault, then, lays at Dell's feet, not the customer.

     I had the same situation with Verizon regarding their DSL support with a Linksys router. They rufused to help me out ("we don't want to support your network"), yet their website shows that you could get their service with THE EXACT SAME ROUTER included in a higher monthly price. "Oh", says I, "does that mean that you'll help me with the configuration if I order this package?" Their answer: no.

     This guy/gal is a victim of corporate runaround. Dell is bowing to pressure from people who want to run Linux on Dell servers, but not enough that they'll actually support such installs. Heck, who wants to bet that getting the "corporate-approved" package would result in the customer getting the same lame answers, and even lamer excuses? Dell wants you to buy their stuff, then leave them alone.

     I think I'll save a step, and jump directly to the latter.

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Customer didn't use Dell supplied Linux[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#12)
by talmy on Tue Jan 25, 2005 at 01:28:53 PM PDT

Unfortunately, there are lots of Linuxes out there and they are not all compatible. When this server was first released, Dell didn't offer Linux. Now they do. Obviously they have custom drivers for the Red Hat Linux they sell. If the original griper had done some investigative work prior to his purchase and non-supported software install, he would have found lots of reported problems installing Linux with the SATA drives in the current Dell systems that have the latest Intel bridge chips.

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Nice way to waste time[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#9)
by Anonymous User on Tue Jan 25, 2005 at 12:39:49 PM PDT

"Not being a full-time computer person, it took me a total of four weeks to try everything they suggested and everything I could think of. It still did not work as desired." Or you could have spent 1 hr on any good linux consultant and been up and running. People need learn then limits and outsource at that point. I'm all for DIY, but 4 frigging weeks - get a clue.

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Re: Nice way to waste time[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#16)
by Anonymous User on Wed Jan 26, 2005 at 06:22:38 AM PDT

Do you know any linux consultants who will come out to a site for one, and only one, billable hour?

Besides, one point of this article was that Dell had pulled a switcheroo on the time allowed to complete the process, burying it in the fine print.

Score one for the I-don't-have-time-for-this-Windows-always-just-works crowd.

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RTFWS (Read the fine Web Site)[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#13)
by unixace on Tue Jan 25, 2005 at 03:37:52 PM PDT

A simple search of Dell's web site with the keywords "sc420 raid linux" turns up the following link:

http://support.dell.com/support/downloads/format.aspx?releaseid=r84452&c=us&l=en&s=gen&a mp;cs=

The page specifically states that with Linux you must turn off the hardware RAID on the controller and they recommend using Linux software-based RAID for mirroring, etc.

We trashed our primary Linux drive when a second SATA drive was installed on an SC420 server without disabling the RAID as indicated. Yes, it cost us a day to rebuild the file system but it is on the web site in black and white. I don't know if the errata was included with the server as the install was done remotely. But it only took us 15 minutes to find the link and the recommendation on Dell''s web site.

I have always found Dell's support to be at least as good if not better than any other IT company I have had to deal with over the past 20 years. None of them are perfect. And for the price you pay for this server I can't see how they can even afford to talk you at all!

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Dell's hi-end support is also unbelievably bad[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#15)
by Anonymous User on Wed Jan 26, 2005 at 05:04:01 AM PDT

Last summer I bought a $4000 Dell PC, almost the highest end workstation configuration possible (e.g., 4GB memory). My students had HW problems adding a DVD burner, and tried Dell support since it appeared to be an issue with the Dell. The runaround they got was almost unbelievable.

It started by Dell saying that, since the machine was purchased via my employer's computer store, the machine wasn't actually in my name, they would only talk to the person listed in their records. Ok, who is that? They wouldn't tell me!

When we'd worked thru that one, Dell's service went downhill from there, e.g., involving hours on hold. For $4000 I expect not to be insulted like this. Don't buy from Dell.

In contrast, a year ago I bought another machine from Motherboard Express, coincidentally with HW SCSI RAID. That HW raid works fine with both Linux and Windows.

Finally, Dell's hi-end prices are not even competitive, unless you get a quote for considerably below the prices listed on their website, which is what I did.

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Should have called first or paid for redhat[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#18)
by Anonymous User on Thu Feb 03, 2005 at 12:56:58 PM PDT

If you go on the sited and choose the $349 option to have Dell pre install Redhat with 1 year of support then choose the SATA Raid option you get a red flag that it is incompatible with the operating system. If he would have called and asked if the sata raid was compatible with linux he most likely would have been told that it wasn't. You get what you pay for.

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Talk about taking customers for granted...[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#19)
by No Dell for me Dude on Thu Feb 03, 2005 at 06:36:31 PM PDT

Another Dell experience. I bought a laptop for my wife for Christmas. We were away at Christmas and then away again a couple of weeks later. The computer was left home and was hardly used. Last weekend, my wife discovered an issue with the DVD drive and we called Dell. They sent a tech out and he discovered that not only was the DVD drive bad, but the motherboard needs to be replace because some of the metal on it or around it is bent. His feeling was that Dell should replace the machine, so I called them. Not only will Dell not replace the machine, because we are out of the 21 day total satisfaction period, but we were also informed that the new motherboard is a refurbished part! Also, if down the road Dell decides to replace the laptop, it will be replaced with a refurbished machine. This is with a computer that has, in my view, what would be called a manufacturing defect! Nice to see how they stand behind their workmanship. This is one more reminder why I put my desktop machine together myself. I know one thing. I will never buy another thing from Dell.

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Link spam[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#21)
by sconeu on Sun Feb 06, 2005 at 10:39:47 PM PDT

parent is link spam

--
I am not merely a "consumer" or a "taxpayer". I am a Citizen of the United States of America.
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The link is hilarious, though.[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#22)
by foxyshadis1 on Mon Feb 07, 2005 at 01:47:29 AM PDT

'Online Poker' must be repeated 10,000 times. Didn't google quit indexing pages like that years ago?

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DELLS NO RETURN POLICY[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#24)
by Anonymous User on Mon Dec 05, 2005 at 05:52:14 PM PDT

RECENTLY I PURCHASED A WIRELESS ROUTER FROM DELL ONLINE I COLD NOT GET THE ROUTER TO INSTALL I WORTE DELL A NOTE REQUESTING A CREDIT RETURN AUTHORIZATION ON FRIDAY I RECEIVED AN AUTOMATED RESPONSE MONDAY MORNING I RECEIVED A RESPONSE TO GO TO TECHNICAL SUPPORT I DID NTO WANT TECHNICAL SUPPORT I WAS TIRED OF TRYING TO INSTALL A NO INSTALL ROUTER MODEM I ANSWERED AND SAID I WANTED A CREDIT AUTHORIZATION AND STILL DO NOT HAVE IT. BUY FOM DELL AND YOU CAN COUNT ON A REFUSAL TO ACCEPT A RETURN. WHY SHOULD I BUY FROM DELL WHEN OTHER COMPANIES WILL ALLOW A RETURN AND DELL WILL NOT. REST ASSURED I WILL BUY NO MORE COMPUTER ADD ONS FROM DELL I WILL BUY FROM A COMPANY THAT IF IT DOES NOT WORK WILL ACCEPT A RETURN DELL IS NOT VERY SMART IN THEIR NO RETURN POLICY AND CANNOT BUT HELP TO LOSE CUSTOMERS. TEHY LOST ME AS A CUSTOMER.

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jesus christ[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#25)
by Anonymous User on Wed Feb 08, 2006 at 02:14:41 PM PDT

If you talked like that to the repair tech I don't blame them for not wanting to deal with you. SCREAMING AND REFUSING TO USE PUNCTUATION IS A GOOD WAY TO GET PEOPLE TO TAKE YOU SERIOUSLY RARRAGHHGHG. I'm sure you have a normal speaking voice, but it's hard to make sense of your post without punctuation. I work in Dell returns. Guys like this call every day. "HELLO WINDOWS IS FAILING OBVIOUSLY YOUR COMPUTER IS DEFECTIVE GIVE ME BACK ALL MY MONEY AND ALSO PAY ME EXTRA FOR MY HORRIBLE PERSONAL PAIN." Eat a bag of hell. If you can't be arsed to check and see if your homegrown OS is supported by our hardware, that's your own damn fault. As for the teacher, hey, guess what? If you can't provide the name of the person who bought the system, we can't take your word for it and issue you an RMA. Sorry, champ. That's called privacy policy and it's standard for every company on earth. It may have inconvenienced you for five minutes but it saved that tech person's job, because we get hella fired if we give out any of that kind of info. It's easy to blame the company though, right? It's easy for you to call and scream at me, making 8 bucks an hour, about what a horrible cunt I am because you chose to install your own OS and save a few bucks and then realized you don't know how. I'm glad the people I work with aren't jerks, because everyone else I talk to all day is. Think for a second that we're human beings too, kay?

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You work for Dell???[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#26)
by Anonymous User on Sat Mar 25, 2006 at 01:12:07 AM PDT

I've purchased 5 dells in the past few years, I can't comment on returns because I've never had to return one.  I can comment on hardware tech support, however; every time I have had an issue with failed hardware Dell has replaced the item in question promptly.  I must also say that I have never encountered anyone as rude and arrogant as the last poster working for dell in any capacity whatsoever.

I also have to comment about the fact that you just might get someone who lives in India or Malaysia when you call, although I hate the fact that our jobs are outsourced, that is the fact of the matter here.  I don't know where you're coming from but the Indians in my world speak English, and they do it quite well.  I prefer to get a foreigner when I call, they are polite; they are quite happy to do their jobs for the little that they get paid.  I doubt any American would even bend over to pick up their monthly pay.

I'm almost positive the last guy is American; maybe I have encountered you.  Are you the jerk who automatically forwards calls hoping you can get through your shift without doing a lick of work?  That is the American dream, isn't it:  do nothing, get paid, demand more and complain about how hard it is to do the job you don't even try to do!

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eve isk[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#27)
by samezhen on Wed Jul 23, 2008 at 12:54:27 AM PDT

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Gary Winnick[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#28)
by Anonymous User on Mon Jul 28, 2008 at 06:34:25 AM PDT

As Chairman of The Winnick Family Foundation, Gary Winnick also funds such initiatives as The Winnick Family Clinical Research Center at Cedars-Sinai Medical Center, the Los Angeles Winnick Children's Zoo, Museum of Tolerance Jerusalem, Birthright Israel, Koreh L.A., Skirball Cultural Center Winnick Hall, The Winnick International Conference Center at the Simon Wiesenthal Center, L.A. Police Foundation Community College Scholarship Program and many more.

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m[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#29)
by msa6el on Wed Aug 13, 2008 at 05:37:58 AM PDT

حارة المساطيل - مساطيلمواضيع مميزه - مواضيع ترحيب - مواضيع عامه - نكت - مواضيع مضحكه- عياره - زحف - صور رحلات- سياحه - تصوير فوتوغرافي - مواضيع اسلاميه - دعوه وارشاد -نقاشات - مواضيع جاده - منتدى الجاده - الحياة الاسرية - مشاكل اجتماعيه - شعر نبطي - شعر عامي - قصايد - قصائد- محاورات - مسلسلات - افلام - تورنت - تورنيت - لوست - برزن بريك - الهروب الكبير - lost - prison break - ملفات تورنت - تحميل افلام - تحميل تورنت - الدوري السعودي - تحليلات - مباريات - مباراة- دوري - المنتخب - دوري - نادي - الدوري الاوروبي - ريال مدريد - برشلونة - رابطة الابطال - ميلان - الانتر - مانشستر- تشلسي - يوفي - تحميل برامج - برامج جديدة - جديد البرامج - برامج نوكيا -برامج سوني اركسون - ثيمات نوكيا- نغمات - رسايل- رسائل- مسجات - مسجات وسائط - رسائل وسائط - mms - دروس فوتوشوب - تصاميم - تواقيع - اسهم - فوريكس - فوركس - سوق المال - الاسهم - تداول- ترافيان - العاب اونلاين - مواضي ماصله - اقتراحات

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مسلسل نور حلقات مسلسل نور تحميل حلقات مسلسل نور مشاهدة حلقات مسلسل نور سنوات الضياع مسلسل سنوات الضياع حلقات مسلسل سنوات الضياع تحميل حلقات مسلسل سنوات الضياع مشاهدة حلقات سنوات الضياع شاعر المليون 3  حلقات شاعر المليون 3 مشاهدة حلقات شاعر المليون 3 تحميل حلقات شاعر المليون 3 ملابس نسائيه سهره مكياج make up تحميل كتب الهلال - النصر - ياسر القحطاني السعودي اهداف - لقطات - تغطيات برامج - كراك - سيريل نمبر كيجين ثيم- ثيمات - جوال -ألعاب جوال - برامج جوال - نوكيا سوني اركسون Sony Ericsson Nokia   N80 6630 N71 E60 N93 N73 N70 N72 N95 المطور N91 وظائف - شركات - مؤسسات -ترفيان - travian - العاب اون لاين - ألعاب حرب مسلسلات رمضانيه - طاش - باب الحاره - بيني وبينك - عيال قرية -



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asder[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#30)
by Anonymous User on Wed Nov 05, 2008 at 10:55:24 AM PDT

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