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Constitutional DRM: Part II

By Ed Foster, Section Columns
Posted on Thu Jul 29, 2004 at 01:14:23 AM PDT

Who would have guessed I have so many constitutional scholars amongst my readers? My recent weblog item where a software company owner suggested copy protection is unconstitutional brought a massive response from readers arguing many different sides of the issue.


Many readers passionately agreed with the software company owner that DRM (digital rights management) is being used unfairly on software products. "As an IT consultant, CIO, and a former writer of custom applications, all I can say is that I absolutely agree," wrote one reader. "Copy protection on sold software should be illegal. And so should violating the copyright. These elaborate copy protection schemes reflect a particular kind of corporate paranoia and cowardice that are anathema to people who believe in the principles on which this country was founded. Until software buyers start refusing to buy protected software, it will only get worse."

But even many of those who agreed in spirit with the software company owner pointed out that the Bill of Rights only restricts government action. "The argument about constitutionality is compelling, but completely without credence," wrote a reader who is attorney. "The first, fourth and fifth amendments enumerate rights which the constitution implied were 'reserved' by the states, creating federal rights protecting individuals from GOVERNMENT intrusion. I have an absolute right to search my employees' desk, my employees' locker or, for that matter, my children's rooms if I elect to do so, but neither my home state or the Federal government may do so without a warrant. One can contract away any right, whether constitutional or otherwise --- and the software companies' contracts grant 'licenses' to use their product. I don't like it; I'm not happy about it; but if I choose to do so I can vote with my wallet, or use open source."

Another reader went further, arguing that copy protection is not only constitutional but justified. "I find completely unconvincing the argument that product activation primarily punishes legitimate users," the reader wrote. "I know very few people who don't cheat on software licenses to some degree when they can. My own house was never fully legal with respect to Windows licenses until Windows XP's product activation feature made it hard to cheat. I wish we were all better people, and that product activation weren't needed, but from what I've seen, product activation, disruptive though it is, is a necessary mechanism for software vendors to limit piracy. But, it's a blunt instrument, and one that costs the vendors a great deal in the process of making us legal. What is really wanted is a reliable software metering technology that would permit meaningful pay-by-usage licensing."

The more popular opinion was in favor of the software owner's basic message. "As with most computer users, over the years I've nodded at the licensing and activation hoops I've been asked to jump through and gone ahead and jumped," wrote one reader. "However, in this age where many of our rights are being curtailed -- or even yanked right out from under our feet -- your reader's comments about several of the Bill of Rights being trod upon by copy protection schemes has struck a chord. I find myself agreeing with him and think that this may be the time to take action."

Certainly not all readers bought the idea that sneakwrap licenses are binding contracts that can deprive you of any and all rights. "In law class, we were taught there are several basic requirements for a valid contract," wrote one reader. "These include (1) a value given in exchange for (2) a value received, (3) a "meeting of the minds" on the terms of transfer and entitlement, (4) a specific description of the things to be transferred, and (5) a timely, INFORMED consent on the part of both parties to the contractual terms. What the heck has happened to part (3) and (5) of basic contract law? Have all the basic legal protections existing in thousands of legal precedents simply been forgotten in the software companies' mindless legal prose? Has the "Twinkie defense" syndrome come to contract law? Can any of these things be deemed to have happened by the mere act of opening a package without ever even having seen the contract? When did deliberate deception in a contract become the de facto standard for an acceptable contract?"

A few readers advanced the idea that, by making DRM inviolable under the DMCA, the government is complicit. "The obvious response to copy protection being unconstitutional is that the fourth amendment applies to the government, not private companies," one reader wrote. "However things aren't so simple when it comes to this issue. Under the DMCA the government agrees to assist companies with whatever copy protection schemes they come up with. As you've written about many times, this allows companies to create rules on what can and can't be done with their copyrighted works, and the government will enforce this as if it were law. Since companies are effectively writing their own laws based on power granted from congress, that power is limited by the Constitution."

And there's another way to look at this issue of constitutional protections. "Perhaps the constitution should protect American citizens against each other and corporations, as well as the government," read one posted comment. "Who should the average U.S. citizen be protected against: the U.S. government or U.S. corporations, or both? Just a thought from an outsider, an interested South African. Have a look at South Africa's constitution and bill of rights, which bind all legal persons, natural (i.e. people) and juristic (i.e. corporate), to the same set of standards to protect individual persons."

So let's hear your thoughts on this discussion. But let me not make the mistake I made last time by suggesting you e-mail me. Please post your comments on the GripeLog version of this story, so everyone can see what you have to say. After all, I don't want to deprive anyone of their constitutional rights just because I'm a slow reader.

--------------------

Post your comments about this column below or write me directly at Foster@gripe2ed.com. To receive this column every week in my free e-mail newsletter, please go to my subscription page and follow the instructions to opt-in for the EdFoster mailing list.

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Constitutional DRM: Part II | 14 comments (14 topical) | Post A Comment
Unconscionability in Contract Law[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#1)
by Anonymous User on Thu Jul 29, 2004 at 11:28:35 AM PDT

When I was in Law school in the early 80s, the doctrine of unconscienability was a hot topic. The doctrine indicated that if a contract was unconsienable due to any of several possibilities (including misunderstanding, inequality in bargaining, duress,or WAS TOTALLY UNFAIR TO ONE OF THE PARTIES, among others), it WAS NOT A VALID CONTRACT and could not be enforced. It seems that this has been discarded in software contracts, as they are uniformly duressful, misunderstood, and unfair. Until someone actually gets a case to the US Supreme Court and the basis for the "Licensing Model" is tested by the nine wise persons, vote with your wallet.

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ee[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#14)
by Anonymous User on Thu Aug 07, 2008 at 07:00:38 AM PDT

Free YouTube Downloader | YouTube to iPod | YouTube on PSP | YouTube to MP3 | YouTube to MP4 | YouTube to 3GP | YouTube to AVI | YouTube to MPEG | YouTube to WMV | YouTube to DivX | YouTube to XviD | YouTube to MOV | YouTube to WMA | YouTube Ripper YouTube to iPod | YouTube to iPhone | YouTube to PSP | YouTube to Zune | YouTube to MP4 | YouTube to Apple TV | YouTube to H.264 | YouTube to 3GP

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Maybe we should enforce it among each other?[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#2)
by kamnet on Thu Jul 29, 2004 at 11:44:32 AM PDT

While there is no doubt that all these EULAs satisfy the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, I also have no doubt that corproations daily violation both IN SPIRIT.

Perhaps it is short-sightedness on the part of the founding fathers when they drafted the Constitution, and felt that after all the struggles we faced together against a tyrant state that we would not turn such tyrrany against each other.

Could you imagine, for example, our government arresting American patriots for distributing unauthorized renditions of "Yankee Doodle" via "peer-to-peer networks", on behalf of the British surgeon who originally composed it?

How much influence would Thomas Payne's "Common Sense" have been if he had demanded that publishers pay an exclusive royalty to distribute it rather than ignore the piracy of his work (albeit credited), and instead took those publishers to court to demand payment?

We absolutely needed those protections (both then and now) formally written to paper to remind people both inside and outside of government that we are, in the end, human beings who are to be respected and treasured. Who would have imagined that you would also need to write in stone what God had already written on the hearts of men?

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Eula's and copyrights[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#6)
by Anonymous User on Fri Aug 06, 2004 at 01:46:30 AM PDT

There is alot of doubt regarding the legality of EULA's. Violating a copyright and violating an EULA are not the same thing regardless of the efforts of the software industry to delude us into believing they are. The enforceability of an EULA is still an open question. twenty years ago it would have been a closed question - and the answer would have been "NO", but as we move forward and more and more industries feign a critical dependence on shrinkwrap EULA's it becomes less likely that the courts will be willing to apply established law in a manner they percive as disruptive. Our founding fathers used a different and telling name for copyrights and patents - "monopolies", though with much debate they were included in the constitution, it was mostly considered a trade-off of evils. But then the expectation was that "monopolies: would empower small inventors and authors to be able to standup to powerful publishers and businesses - look how well that has worked.

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Constitutional? Not necessarily.[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#3)
by ISSurvivor on Thu Jul 29, 2004 at 01:47:13 PM PDT

While I doubt this would work in a modern-day US courtroom, the constitutionality of various software license provisions is unlikely. Take as an example the "gag rule" in many licenses that prohibits the publishing of reviews or benchmarks.

The first amendment states, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances."

Among the laws passed by Congress are those that allow corporations to exist and establish their rights and responsibilities, and those that govern the enforceability of contracts. That means that when the corporation enforces the gag rule, the law passed by Congress allowing that corporation to exist and the laws governing the enforceability of contracts have unconstitutional consequences, making them unconstitutional.

The logic, I think, is sound. The likelihood of a modern court accepting that logic is, I think, remote.

- Bob Lewis

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Product Activation[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#4)
by Anonymous User on Sat Jul 31, 2004 at 02:35:53 PM PDT

I don't really have a problem with copy protection itself, but I have severe problems with "Product Activation". I don't keep a motherboard in a chassis more than a year, and am constantly changing parts. To have the software shut down and require me to "activate" it is a severe imposition. Also, what if the company goes under or decides to discontinue support for the product? The next time I need activation, I'm toast. I avoided XP for a long time, and am now installing it on one computer because I have software that won't run under Win2k. I still haven't "upgraded" to Photoshop CS from Photoshop 7, and probably won't, and I'll try to avoid any software implementing "Product Activation" schemes. I think that if vendors feel they need protection, they should implement schemes to prevent copying the CD, and then issue two copies in the package to take care of the backup problem. If a home user puts an extra copy on his wife's and/or son's/daughter's machine, so what? The vendor probably hasn't lost anything, as that user most likely won't buy multiple copies anyway. He'll just do without on the other machines in the home. Product Activation has just punished this user, and has gained absolutely nothing for the vendor, other than bad blood. It's certainly not going to stop the real pirates, as the Russian and Chinese hackers probably have the code broken before the software even goes public.

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Constitutional DRM: Part II[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#5)
by Anonymous User on Fri Aug 06, 2004 at 01:35:16 AM PDT

The constitution and bill of rights may only define the limits of the power of the federal government (and in many cases the sates) However, Intelectual property rights are a set of rights created by the constitution - they do not exist elsewhere. Nor does the concept exist in common law. Until the past two centuries there was no consideration of the possibility that if you could afford to do so you were prohibited from copying anothers art, music, literature, or ideas. The concept that ideas can somehow be owned is ludicrous. We would presume that owning "gravity" or E=MC^2 to be meaningless, why should we beleive you can own a guitar riff, a sorting algorithm, or a plot ? Regardless my point is that the though there have been some strange constitutional interpretations on this subject, there are constitional issues regarding DRM, because the Rights being protected by DRM are created by the federal government in the constitution.

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lingering[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#10)
by rickman on Thu Jun 05, 2008 at 07:29:15 PM PDT

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wslaat[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#11)
by thegame on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 07:10:43 AM PDT

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dfsf[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#12)
by samezhen on Thu Jul 10, 2008 at 08:27:48 PM PDT

<H1>APW机柜ATEN切换器威宝机柜eve iskeve iskcar wash systemscar wash systemscar wash equipmentcar wash equipmentautomatic car washautomatic car washcar washing machinecar washing machinecar washcar wash北京汽车租赁网络地板防静电地板白癜风疱疹生殖器疱疹毛刷工业毛刷 毛刷厂清洗毛刷无机钢筋锚固料锚固料融达北京融达北京融达建业渗透性聚合物砂浆聚合物砂浆高强渗透性聚合物砂浆灌浆料灌浆北京灌浆料不锈钢钢绞线粘钢胶植筋胶结构胶灌浆剂高强无收缩灌浆料建筑结构胶水泥灌浆剂加固料碳纤维胶碳纤维胶灌注粘钢胶树脂灌缝胶办证环氧地坪环氧自流平帕金森办证血管瘤铜门货架货架厂肝血管瘤 疱疹疱疹病毒疣病毒疣数控火焰切割机数控等离子切割机电焊机焊机指纹锁指纹锁周界报警:瓷贴面烤瓷冠氧化锆全瓷牙四环素牙牙齿不齐全瓷牙铸瓷牙铸瓷冠二氧化锆烤瓷牙牙齿美容牙齿美白牙科牙齿美白牙周病牙齿种植北京口腔医院口臭补牙牙疼牙齿美容牙龈出血烤瓷牙牙齿矫正种植牙齿科除皱隆胸吸脂瘦脸开眼角隆鼻鼻头双眼皮眼袋隆下巴阴道紧缩 除皱除皱双眼皮眼袋眼袋眼袋阴道紧缩吸脂吸脂隆胸隆胸瘦脸隆鼻开眼角 品牌服装服装加盟服装代理服装经销品牌男装品牌女装男装加盟女装加盟服装厂北京服装租赁品牌服装服装加盟服装代理服装经销品牌女装品牌服装服装代理男装加盟服装经销 品牌男装品牌女装男装加盟女装加盟服装厂vi企业形象设计北京设计公司展览展示设计标志设计黄金矿工小游戏黄金矿工小游戏美女餐厅小游戏美女餐厅小游戏拳皇小游戏拳皇小游戏三国麻将小游戏风水起名eve isk汽车影音汽车改装贴膜汽车装饰汽车保养汽车配件汽车维修汽车美容汽车坐垫氙气灯汽GPS导航防盗器车载mp3润滑油汽车音响轮胎蓄电池汽车用品尖锐湿疣尖锐湿疣治疗生殖器疱疹生殖器疱疹治疗疱疹治疗疱疹的治疗疱疹图片病毒性疱疹单纯疱疹疱疹病毒疱疹症状男性生殖器疱疹症状男性生殖器疱疹什么是生殖器疱疹生殖器疱疹的治疗生殖器疱疹怎么治疗生殖器疱疹如何治疗生殖器疱疹治疗方法生殖器疱疹怎么治生殖器疱疹的治疗生殖器疱疹的治疗中药治疗生殖器疱疹复发性生殖器疱疹治疗生殖器疱疹的药物治疗生殖器疱疹的特效药生殖器疱疹治疗尖锐湿疣症状什么是尖锐湿疣宫颈尖锐湿疣阴道尖锐湿疣男性尖锐湿疣假性尖锐湿疣尖锐湿疣怎么治疗尖锐湿疣治疗方法尖锐湿疣的治疗中药治疗尖锐湿疣治疗尖锐湿疣的药物治疗尖锐湿疣的特效药男性尖锐湿疣尖锐湿疣复发尖锐湿疣图片铜门写字楼巡展写字楼巡展</H1> 阴道炎 阴道炎治疗 滴虫性阴道炎 细菌性阴道炎 霉菌性阴道炎 月经不调 痛经 月经不调的治疗 痛经的治疗 产前检查 孕检 女性体检 女性检查 体检套餐 人流 无痛人流费用 无痛人流优惠 无痛人流套餐 人流费用 人流优惠 人流套餐 人流医院 无痛人流医院 北京人流医院 北京人流价格 处女膜修复医院 北京处女膜修复医院 北京处女膜修复 妇科疾病 常见妇科病 女性常见妇科病 女性妇科病 孕妇妇科病 妇科病种类 老年妇科病 女人妇科病 少女妇科病 妇科病的表现 儿童妇科病 妇女妇科病 产后妇科病 严重妇科病 孕妇妇科病 女性妇科疾病 常见妇科疾病 外阴白斑病 子宫颈糜烂 重度宫颈糜烂 轻度宫颈糜烂 中度宫颈糜烂 宫颈糜烂二度 慢性宫颈糜烂 非淋菌性尿道炎 非淋性尿道炎 女性尿道炎 霉菌性尿道炎 慢性盆腔炎 急性宫颈炎 慢性子宫颈炎 女性附件炎 急性附件炎 子宫内膜炎 慢性子宫内膜炎 子宫内膜炎症 子宫下垂 卵巢早衰 妇科症状 妇科病症状 常见妇科病症状 妇科病及其症状 妇科疾病症状 妇科病炎症 妇科炎症症状 女性妇科炎症 常见妇科炎症 子宫炎症症状 输卵管炎症症状 附件炎症状 子宫附件炎症状 卵巢囊肿症状 外阴白斑症状 宫颈糜烂症状 子宫肌瘤症状 子宫颈癌症状 宫颈糜烂出血 非淋菌性尿道炎症状 尿道炎症状 盆腔炎症状 宫颈炎症状 白带异常症状 孕期白带异常 白带多 白带带血 白带发黄 白带有血 白带异味 水样白带 白带黄绿色 白带豆腐渣 月经不调症状 附件炎症状 孕妇白带异常 女性白带异常 女性月经不调 少女月经不调 更年期月经不调 外阴白斑 外阴搔痒 外阴红肿 外阴瘙痒 宫外孕症状 宫外孕早期症状 乳腺增生症状 子宫内膜炎症状 子宫内膜异位 子宫癌症状 子宫癌早期症状 生殖整形 处女膜修补 处女膜修复手术 处女膜修补手术 阴道紧缩 阴道紧缩术 阴道松弛 处女膜再造 妇科整形 生殖器整形 妇科整形手术 生殖器整形手术 女性生殖器整形 女性生殖整形 阴唇整形术 小阴唇整形 小阴唇整形手术 妇科手术 妇科手术 妇科腹腔镜手术 妇科手术护理 子宫肌瘤微创手术 宫颈糜烂手术 多发性子宫肌瘤手术 子宫肌瘤手术 卵巢囊肿手术 宫外孕手术 人流手术 无痛人流手术 可视人流手术 人工流产手术 乳腺增生手术 乳腺微创手术 输卵管微创手术 清宫手术 引产手术 流产手术 宫腔镜手术 宫腔镜取胚术 刮宫手术 女性节育手术 子宫癌手术 子宫切除 子宫肌瘤切除 宫颈疾病 阴道炎 盆腔炎 卵巢疾病 痛经 子宫肌瘤 月经不调 乳腺疾病 宫外孕 处女膜修复 节育环放置 不孕不育 避孕 宫颈糜烂 健康知识 男性疾病 女性疾病 不孕不育

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dsafd[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#13)
by samezhen on Thu Jul 10, 2008 at 08:31:08 PM PDT

<H1>APW机柜ATEN切换器威宝机柜eve iskeve iskcar wash systemscar wash systemscar wash equipmentcar wash equipmentautomatic car washautomatic car washcar washing machinecar washing machinecar washcar wash北京汽车租赁网络地板防静电地板白癜风疱疹生殖器疱疹毛刷工业毛刷 毛刷厂清洗毛刷无机钢筋锚固料锚固料融达北京融达北京融达建业渗透性聚合物砂浆聚合物砂浆高强渗透性聚合物砂浆灌浆料灌浆北京灌浆料不锈钢钢绞线粘钢胶植筋胶结构胶灌浆剂高强无收缩灌浆料建筑结构胶水泥灌浆剂加固料碳纤维胶碳纤维胶灌注粘钢胶树脂灌缝胶办证环氧地坪环氧自流平帕金森办证血管瘤铜门货架货架厂肝血管瘤 疱疹疱疹病毒疣病毒疣数控火焰切割机数控等离子切割机电焊机焊机指纹锁指纹锁周界报警:瓷贴面烤瓷冠氧化锆全瓷牙四环素牙牙齿不齐全瓷牙铸瓷牙铸瓷冠二氧化锆烤瓷牙牙齿美容牙齿美白牙科牙齿美白牙周病牙齿种植北京口腔医院口臭补牙牙疼牙齿美容牙龈出血烤瓷牙牙齿矫正种植牙齿科除皱隆胸吸脂瘦脸开眼角隆鼻鼻头双眼皮眼袋隆下巴阴道紧缩 除皱除皱双眼皮眼袋眼袋眼袋阴道紧缩吸脂吸脂隆胸隆胸瘦脸隆鼻开眼角 品牌服装服装加盟服装代理服装经销品牌男装品牌女装男装加盟女装加盟服装厂北京服装租赁品牌服装服装加盟服装代理服装经销品牌女装品牌服装服装代理男装加盟服装经销 品牌男装品牌女装男装加盟女装加盟服装厂vi企业形象设计北京设计公司展览展示设计标志设计黄金矿工小游戏黄金矿工小游戏美女餐厅小游戏美女餐厅小游戏拳皇小游戏拳皇小游戏三国麻将小游戏风水起名eve isk汽车影音汽车改装贴膜汽车装饰汽车保养汽车配件汽车维修汽车美容汽车坐垫氙气灯汽GPS导航防盗器车载mp3润滑油汽车音响轮胎蓄电池汽车用品尖锐湿疣尖锐湿疣治疗生殖器疱疹生殖器疱疹治疗疱疹治疗疱疹的治疗疱疹图片病毒性疱疹单纯疱疹疱疹病毒疱疹症状男性生殖器疱疹症状男性生殖器疱疹什么是生殖器疱疹生殖器疱疹的治疗生殖器疱疹怎么治疗生殖器疱疹如何治疗生殖器疱疹治疗方法生殖器疱疹怎么治生殖器疱疹的治疗生殖器疱疹的治疗中药治疗生殖器疱疹复发性生殖器疱疹治疗生殖器疱疹的药物治疗生殖器疱疹的特效药生殖器疱疹治疗尖锐湿疣症状什么是尖锐湿疣宫颈尖锐湿疣阴道尖锐湿疣男性尖锐湿疣假性尖锐湿疣尖锐湿疣怎么治疗尖锐湿疣治疗方法尖锐湿疣的治疗中药治疗尖锐湿疣治疗尖锐湿疣的药物治疗尖锐湿疣的特效药男性尖锐湿疣尖锐湿疣复发尖锐湿疣图片铜门写字楼巡展写字楼巡展</H1> 阴道炎 阴道炎治疗 滴虫性阴道炎 细菌性阴道炎 霉菌性阴道炎 月经不调 痛经 月经不调的治疗 痛经的治疗 产前检查 孕检 女性体检 女性检查 体检套餐 人流 无痛人流费用 无痛人流优惠 无痛人流套餐 人流费用 人流优惠 人流套餐 人流医院 无痛人流医院 北京人流医院 北京人流价格 处女膜修复医院 北京处女膜修复医院 北京处女膜修复 妇科疾病 常见妇科病 女性常见妇科病 女性妇科病 孕妇妇科病 妇科病种类 老年妇科病 女人妇科病 少女妇科病 妇科病的表现 儿童妇科病 妇女妇科病 产后妇科病 严重妇科病 孕妇妇科病 女性妇科疾病 常见妇科疾病 外阴白斑病 子宫颈糜烂 重度宫颈糜烂 轻度宫颈糜烂 中度宫颈糜烂 宫颈糜烂二度 慢性宫颈糜烂 非淋菌性尿道炎 非淋性尿道炎 女性尿道炎 霉菌性尿道炎 慢性盆腔炎 急性宫颈炎 慢性子宫颈炎 女性附件炎 急性附件炎 子宫内膜炎 慢性子宫内膜炎 子宫内膜炎症 子宫下垂 卵巢早衰 妇科症状 妇科病症状 常见妇科病症状 妇科病及其症状 妇科疾病症状 妇科病炎症 妇科炎症症状 女性妇科炎症 常见妇科炎症 子宫炎症症状 输卵管炎症症状 附件炎症状 子宫附件炎症状 卵巢囊肿症状 外阴白斑症状 宫颈糜烂症状 子宫肌瘤症状 子宫颈癌症状 宫颈糜烂出血 非淋菌性尿道炎症状 尿道炎症状 盆腔炎症状 宫颈炎症状 白带异常症状 孕期白带异常 白带多 白带带血 白带发黄 白带有血 白带异味 水样白带 白带黄绿色 白带豆腐渣 月经不调症状 附件炎症状 孕妇白带异常 女性白带异常 女性月经不调 少女月经不调 更年期月经不调 外阴白斑 外阴搔痒 外阴红肿 外阴瘙痒 宫外孕症状 宫外孕早期症状 乳腺增生症状 子宫内膜炎症状 子宫内膜异位 子宫癌症状 子宫癌早期症状 生殖整形 处女膜修补 处女膜修复手术 处女膜修补手术 阴道紧缩 阴道紧缩术 阴道松弛 处女膜再造 妇科整形 生殖器整形 妇科整形手术 生殖器整形手术 女性生殖器整形 女性生殖整形 阴唇整形术 小阴唇整形 小阴唇整形手术 妇科手术 妇科手术 妇科腹腔镜手术 妇科手术护理 子宫肌瘤微创手术 宫颈糜烂手术 多发性子宫肌瘤手术 子宫肌瘤手术 卵巢囊肿手术 宫外孕手术 人流手术 无痛人流手术 可视人流手术 人工流产手术 乳腺增生手术 乳腺微创手术 输卵管微创手术 清宫手术 引产手术 流产手术 宫腔镜手术 宫腔镜取胚术 刮宫手术 女性节育手术 子宫癌手术 子宫切除 子宫肌瘤切除 宫颈疾病 阴道炎 盆腔炎 卵巢疾病 痛经 子宫肌瘤 月经不调 乳腺疾病 宫外孕 处女膜修复 节育环放置 不孕不育 避孕 宫颈糜烂 健康知识 男性疾病 女性疾病 不孕不育

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mk[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#15)
by msa6el on Wed Aug 13, 2008 at 03:12:02 PM PDT

حارة المساطيل - مساطيلمواضيع مميزه - مواضيع ترحيب - مواضيع عامه - نكت - مواضيع مضحكه- عياره - زحف - صور رحلات- سياحه - تصوير فوتوغرافي - مواضيع اسلاميه - دعوه وارشاد -نقاشات - مواضيع جاده - منتدى الجاده - الحي&