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A Christmas Surprise From ReplayTV: Service Charges

By Ed Foster, Section UnFairUse
Posted on Wed Dec 24, 2003 at 01:42:41 AM PDT

Normally it's not polite to ask how much a gift costs. But if there's a ReplayTV under your Christmas tree tomorrow, make sure you ask the gift giver for the receipt. To activate the ReplayTV service, you may have to prove how much it cost.

"Last week I purchased a ReplayTV 5504 at Circuit City for $150 as a Christmas present for my mother," a reader wrote. "I bought it instead of a Tivo because the box had a big green sticker on it saying 'This ReplayTV unit includes 3 years of ReplayTV service' and I didn't want her having to pay a monthly service charge. Now the ReplayTV-related message boards on the Internet are saying that the company claims the sticker was a mistake, and getting the service activated requires a $12.95 monthly subscription. Talk about bait-and-switch!"


As documented thoroughly in Fat Wallet and AVS forum discussion threads, on Dec. 17th a variety of major retailers including Amazon, Circuit City and RadioShack began promoting new pricing on various ReplayTV 5500 models -- prices less than half the former list price for the same models with the three years of service included.

At first, Replay TV fans thought the new prices must be a mistake, in spite of the green tags, but initial purchasers reported they were indeed able to activate the ReplayTV service without problem. ReplayTV customer service agents confirmed that new prices still included the service bundle, and ReplayTV's website - although not advertising the new prices - continued to state that "All 5500 models include a 3-year subscription to ReplayTV."

On Dec. 22 ReplayTV's parent company posted a press release announcing the new pricing but also stating that the ReplayTV service would now be sold separately for a $12.95 monthly subscription or a lifetime subscription for $299. The next day Replay TV posted a notice on its home page that customers who bought 5500 models under the new pricing - green sticker or no - must pay for a subscription to the service or try to get a refund from their re-seller.

"Our retail partners were asked to help implement this pricing change in a variety of ways," the ReplayTV read in part. "Unfortunately, certain retailers may not have taken the appropriate steps to change the pricing model resulting in potential confusion for customers ... Understandably, some customers may wish to return the product due to the additional required fees, and should resolve the matter with their retailer. We sincerely apologize for any confusion."

While ReplayTV seems to be trying to blame the retailers, it seems odd so many different online and brick-and-mortar would make the same mistakes and fail to remove the green sticker. It's also strange that ReplayTV did not attempt to clarify the situation for almost a week, although the company could not have been unaware of the confusion expressed in the message boards. And to allow that confusion to fester the week before Christmas, letting its boxes be sold under false pretenses, makes it very hard to believe this was just an honest mistake. The biggest surprise we get from our Christmas presents shouldn't be how much it's actually going to cost us.

Whether the mistakes were that of ReplayTV or the retailers, or a combination therefore, it was clearly not the fault of the customers. It is absolutely wrong for the company to now say that those customers who paid a particular price are not entitled to what the packaging, the retailer's promotional materials and ReplayTV itself promised them.

< Brightmail Denies "White List" Deal With Spammer | Licensing Bugs Can Bite Symantec Corporate Customers, Too >


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A Christmas Surprise From ReplayTV: Service Charges | 54 comments (54 topical) | Post A Comment
3-year service commitment[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#1)
by Markz2k on Wed Dec 24, 2003 at 06:19:34 AM PDT

It should be noted that not only did the sticker on the box state 3-years of service is included with the purchase of this ReplayTV, there's also a printed statement in the box that says the same thing. Even if the stores had removed/crossed out the stickers, it's unlikely they would have opened each box and removed the printed statement. I bought a 5504 from Circuit City early on 12/17 after ordering from their web site for an in-store pickup. The product info on their website stated service was included. I picked it up an hour or so later, and it did have the Green Sticker and the printed statement in the box. As of now, my unit is still working, and says nothing about a grace period or activation.

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3 year service of ReplayTV[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#47)
by Anonymous User on Sat Apr 03, 2004 at 04:28:06 PM PDT

They will activate the service...But you need to fax a photo copy of the invoice, the green label, and the serial and model number of the unit. They will act like they do not know what you are talking about untll they learn that you really do have a label, a note inside the box, and a sales slip. This is as of march 26, 2004

[ Parent | Reply to This ]


66[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#106)
by Anonymous User on Tue Aug 12, 2008 at 06:58:59 AM PDT

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[ Parent | Reply to This ]


No legal leg to stand on[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#2)
by Anonymous User on Wed Dec 24, 2003 at 08:56:00 AM PDT

If ReplayTV tries to go through with this, they are just begging for class action and small claims court suits, all of which they will unquestionably lose.

[ Reply to This ]


ReplayTV marketing coup or soup[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#3)
by Anonymous User on Wed Dec 24, 2003 at 09:34:25 AM PDT

I think there was a big mistake made and it was allowed to fester. I do think ReplayTV could make this situation into an advertising bananza while killing legal issues. I for one have problems with paying a large ammount for service while computers and connectivity are blossoming. But at the price and the assurance from the sales person about the situation, I purchased one since it hit my price point as a curiosity. The originator is correct; ReplayTV has their hands into a market price point that is new. ReplayTV can stake claim to this territory and put pressure on Tivo and HD recorder/DVD burner units. They could recend and push all those potential customers away from them into the hands of their competition.

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How DNNK stole Christmas[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#4)
by Anonymous User on Wed Dec 24, 2003 at 10:17:03 AM PDT

If DNNK does drop everyones service, they should know that Class actions are going to include the retailers as well as DNNK, since DNNK was so quick to point the finger at the retailers.

I am pretty sure that the retailers will not be happy with that. Esp since this disaster is probably DNNKs fault

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Cutoff date of 12/23[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#5)
by Anonymous User on Wed Dec 24, 2003 at 10:19:52 AM PDT

It looks like the Replay customer service reps are now saying that any unit that was activated before 12/23 will remain active for 3 years. Any unit activated on or after that date will be required to pay for activation.

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why pick the 25th?[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#6)
by Anonymous User on Wed Dec 24, 2003 at 11:43:43 AM PDT

last I heard christmas is the 25th and these are undoubtedly under someone's tree as a gift. This is a good gift in my opinion, the $149 price is right, no long term commitments to make, just plug and play. This will introduce so many more households to this wonderful product. I think the 23rd is crazy as a cut-off date. I think 12-31-03 is more realistic IN MY OPINION. Of course ReplayTV is crazy, so I guess it fits in well with their scheme. What do I know??

[ Parent | Reply to This ]


Cutoff date[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#10)
by Anonymous User on Wed Dec 24, 2003 at 07:42:48 PM PDT

The cutoff date has nothing to do with any holidays. Replay was originally planning on announcing the price cuts and the activation change on 12/22, which is exactly what they ended up doing. A few retailers decided to cut the prices early, before the activation change went into effect. It sucks for people who get it as gifts and have to activate it, but the problem lies with the retailers. In fact, some CompUSA locations still have signs saying the Replay 5504 for $149 includes 3 years of activation.

[ Parent | Reply to This ]


cut off date for purchasing I understand[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#12)
by Anonymous User on Thu Dec 25, 2003 at 05:23:29 AM PDT

but a cut-off to date to activate is wrong. If I bought before the change and paid $499 but it is still sitting under a tree, riding in someone's car, or sitting waiting for someone to help its technically challenged new owner in installing it? If you bought it before 12-22 (regardless of price), when DNNA announced the pricing, activation change then why should we be stuck paying monthly, yearly fees because it is not set up yet. The problem is not totally with the retailers.

[ Parent | Reply to This ]


My situation..[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#27)
by Anonymous User on Tue Dec 30, 2003 at 01:33:11 PM PDT

I Bought 2 units from Compusa, at the same store, same time (12/19). Both clearly labeled with green sticker saying includes 3 yrs activation / 0.99 per month after that. As well as similar paperwork in the box. Confirmed with Compusa salesperson and manager that activation was included. I set one up that night. Works fine. Didn't open up the 2nd one until 12/27. It says I need to activate. I called ReplayTV support. Initial service rep said she agreed that the situation wasn't right, false advertising etc, but that they can't do anything about it. Escalated to supervisor. He informed me that the retailer screwed up and gave me the wrong box. They were supposed to sell the green sticker boxes for $500. When I asked why the 2 boxes (again, same price, same purchase date) would behave differently, he said they should both be deactivated. My only options are to pay for the service or return the units!

[ Parent | Reply to This ]


Of course the cutoff date involves the holidays[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#28)
by Anonymous User on Tue Dec 30, 2003 at 04:49:59 PM PDT

or Replay staff are complete idiots.  Replay made a radical price change and DID IT AT CHRISTMAS (or so near as to make no difference).  I have a big problem with a company that takes away a service that is promised at purchase time.  But they did AT CHRISTMAS with NO WARNING.  This is when people are looking for gifts and will buy things they normally might not, retailers are extremely busy, everybody is rushed, and when products may sit in a gift box for some time before being used.  Under those conditions, it is absolutely certain there will be confusion, and some people won't get what they expected.

Me, I wouldn't buy a ReplayTV device.  If the company goes under the gizmos are useless.  At $150 with 3 year service I might be willing to take the chance, but not with the added monthly service charge.

[ Parent | Reply to This ]



ReplayTV[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#7)
by Anonymous User on Wed Dec 24, 2003 at 12:27:07 PM PDT

Given the number of retailers who made this alleged "mistake" it seems improbable that they did not get some kind of (poorly-worded? incorrect?) communication from ReplayTV to lead them to reduce the price of the ReplayTV 5504 to $149. I find it hard to imagine that Radio Shack, Amazon, TechDepot, Circuit City, CompUSA (?), Good Guys (?) [not sure about the last two] ALL simultaneouslydecided to make a mistake.

As you point out for 5 days (including 3 working days) till Dec 22nd ReplayTVs web site continued to maintain that ALL 5500 units included 3-year subscriptions. From web forum discussion groups, it appears that ReplayTVs customer service staff confirmed this.

The gracious thing for Replay to do is to accept those purchases prior to their 12/22 press release as being valid 3-year licensees. If they do this right and keep their customers happy, they have a very good chance that when the 3 years run out enough users will be accustomed to the ReplayTV interface that they will buy the next upgrade product from Replay/DNNA.

Failing that they are going to get huge amounts of negative publicity, more than a few small claims court lawsuits (sending a lawyer to defend themselves is going to burn more than the $300 subscription fees ReplayTV hopes to make), possibly getting the FTC and states attorneys general - Eliott Spitzer wannabes, are you listening??, consumer action lines, etc. etc. etc. Maybe Replay's PR firm has advised them that bad publicity is better than no publicity.

This could become a great business school case study - it involves pricing, channels, customer service, crisis management - and no obvious solutions. HBS are you listening?

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The signs in the store said Save $350[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#8)
by Anonymous User on Wed Dec 24, 2003 at 01:47:43 PM PDT

Not did the boxes, say 3 years included, the signs in the stores said 3 years included, and the price said save $350 (Orginal price $499.95, new price $149.95, Save $350) How could you save $350 if you now have to pay $300 for activation ?

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This is a complete mess[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#9)
by Anonymous User on Wed Dec 24, 2003 at 03:36:54 PM PDT

The unit I bought at Radio Shack has a shipping label on it from when the store received it, May 2003. The box says Sonic|Blue who hasn't made these for months, this is definitely an old unit. This had been sitting there that long without selling. I too saw the same sign telling me that I was saving $350 bucks. It sure didn't seem at all odd that non-moving merchandise was priced way down. I wonder how many other ancient (in terms of shelf life to a store) merchandise was moved and if that perhaps was what motivated the stores to not properly inform people that the units now no longer included service?

[ Parent | Reply to This ]


GO TIVO![ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#11)
by Anonymous User on Wed Dec 24, 2003 at 08:15:48 PM PDT

I purchased one of these from one of Replay's retailers, through the retailer's website. The website was clearly showing service included. The box when I went to pick up my order, clearly said 3-years activation included. The insert in the box indicated my unit was activated out of the box. The ReplayTV site displayed that all units of the the model I purchased included 3-years activation. To my surpise when I went to set up the unit tonight as a gift to my wife, the piece of sh*t is asking that I go to Replay's website and subscribe to service -- service, which I thought I already paid for! I hope others in my situation rise up and file complaints against Replay with the local Better Business Bureau and your state's Attorney General's office. This is clearly a case of cosumer fraud! ReplayTV, you suck!

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You hope "others" file complaints?[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#13)
by Anonymous User on Fri Dec 26, 2003 at 10:13:36 PM PDT

In addition to you, I hope, and not instead of you.  If you haven't filed your own complaint, and are waiting for others to do so instead, then you know why ReplayTV thinks it can get away with this.

(Personally, I'm not a ReplayTV or Tivo customer...I don't have a TV!)

[ Parent | Reply to This ]



obvious[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#14)
by Anonymous User on Mon Dec 29, 2003 at 07:57:46 AM PDT

Umm.. isn't it obvious... $150 for a ReplayTV AND 3 years of service... Seems kind of like getting a big screen HDTV for $150. Sounds like that's just pure stupidity from the user.

[ Reply to This ]


Re:Obvious[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#15)
by Anonymous User on Mon Dec 29, 2003 at 10:02:07 AM PDT

You would think, unless you called Circuit City, and Replay TV to confirm that the price was accurate. Both sources confirmed!

[ Parent | Reply to This ]


You are..[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#16)
by Anonymous User on Mon Dec 29, 2003 at 10:20:22 AM PDT

...missing the point completely. There were signs up in stores stating the deals. Stickers on the box and statements in the box claiming the units were already activated. I don't care if they were selling them for $10. The point is, DNNK is performing a bait and switch. Whether that was their intention or not, doesn't really matter. They should of be responsible and intelligent enough to see this coming. New stickers should of been sent to retailers that would of covered the old ones up stating that the units DID NOT include 3 years activation and that the 3 years activation letter inside is null and void. DNNK did not take adequete steps to clarify their position. In fact they took none. The only gray area I see right now is who is going to pay up. The retailer or DNNK. Right now the consumer is holding all the cards.

[ Parent | Reply to This ]


hardly user stupidity[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#17)
by Anonymous User on Mon Dec 29, 2003 at 10:38:04 AM PDT

It's not like getting big screen hdtv for $150 since the TV probably cost more than that to make. DVR's otoh have no expensive picture tube. Really it's just a bundle of generic computer parts attatched to a scammy business model. you talk about 3 years of "service" as if it's some great thing. Requiring the service at all is just an intentional weakness in the machine. There is no reason that these things should be all that expensive, and there is certainly no reason that they ought to require a subscription. Not enough competition yet I guess.

[ Parent | Reply to This ]


Advertised Price![ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#19)
by auctionhugh on Mon Dec 29, 2003 at 11:39:35 AM PDT

If something is clearly advertised for a certain price, I expect to get it for that price! Why is the fact that it is a good deal be an issue?

[ Parent | Reply to This ]


I never even looked at a replay TV before this,[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#20)
by Anonymous User on Mon Dec 29, 2003 at 12:31:18 PM PDT

Why would I know how much its supposed to cost. Digital VCR for $150, sounds.... about right. I also saw a Tivo deal for $99, with $5 a month service. $150 for an offbrand with 3 years service doesnt sound too far off.

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moron -nt[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#23)
by Anonymous User on Mon Dec 29, 2003 at 08:39:07 PM PDT



[ Parent | Reply to This ]


Sounds Reasonable To Me[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#29)
by Anonymous User on Tue Dec 30, 2003 at 05:38:11 PM PDT

That's in the price range of similar hardware such as VCRs and DVD players.  I can get tv listings off the internet for no cost beyond the internet connection fee.  I can put together a PC doing DVR functions for a few hundred dollars, so a dedicated DVR for $150 sounds reasonable to me.  In a world where I can buy a good DVD-rom drive for $40, and a computer for a $1000 that can outthink multi-million dollar supercomputers a decade ago, why would I be surprised a another gadget that dropped in price???

[ Parent | Reply to This ]


Obvious[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#40)
by Anonymous User on Wed Jan 07, 2004 at 11:25:36 AM PDT

>Umm.. isn't it obvious... $150 for a ReplayTV >AND 3 years of service... Seems kind of like >getting a big screen HDTV for $150. Sounds like >that's just pure stupidity from the user. Actaully, it's not so obvious. ReplayTV originally sold their units and provided the scheduling service for free. But after the discovered they could rip you off for a pretty profit like Tivo, they did. There's no reason at all for the service to cost you anything. There are free services out there you can use with your computer in a home made PVR. Why can't these guys let us use them? Greed.

[ Parent | Reply to This ]


DNNA is playing interesting games[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#18)
by Anonymous User on Mon Dec 29, 2003 at 11:29:37 AM PDT

DNNA (the parent company of ReplayTV) is playing an intesting game. Other ReplayTV units (not the ones described above) are sold without activation. Up until this change of pricing, people buying units were told activation would cost $250. However, on December 22 they changed the pricing, and now activation costs $299. So, if you bought a unit to give as a Christmas gift, and didn't activate until Christmas Day, you are out an extra $50.

[ Reply to This ]


DNNA De-activating units today[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#21)
by Anonymous User on Mon Dec 29, 2003 at 04:38:02 PM PDT

There are reports on FatWallet of several 5504 units being disabled today. Not going into grace period where you can continue to use it for X more days, but completely disabled. Holding any shows it has recorded hostage. (It will not record any more previously scheduled shows either.) This has also affected people who contacted Replay CS before purchase and were told activation was included in the price paid, even if that price was $150.  

Everybody, if this happens to you PLEASE report them to the FTC, your states Attorney General's office, and the BBB. Even if you don't want to hassle with the thing and are just going to return it, file complaints with those 3 agencies first. You can file at FTC and BBB online, and many AG offices accept online complaints also. (CA Does)

Don't let corporate America get away with defrauding the consumer. (Any more than they already have, that is.)

[ Reply to This ]



Attorney General Websites For All 50 States + FTC[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#22)
by Anonymous User on Mon Dec 29, 2003 at 07:58:41 PM PDT

The Federal Trade Commission
http://www.ftc.gov/

Attorney General Websites For All 50 States:
Alaska http://www.law.state.ak.us/department/civil/consumer/cpindex.html
Alabama http://www.ago.state.al.us/
Arkansas http://www.ag.state.ar.us/
Arizona http://www.attorneygeneral.state.az.us/
California http://caag.state.ca.us/
Colorado http://www.ago.state.co.us/
Connecticut http://www.cslib.org/attygenl/
Delaware http://www.state.de.us/attgen/
Florida http://legal.firn.edu/
Georgia http://www.state.ga.us/ago/
Hawaii http://www.state.hi.us/ag/
Iowa http://www.iowaattorneygeneral.org/consumer/
Idaho http://www2.state.id.us/ag/
Illinois http://www.ag.state.il.us/
Indiana http://www.in.gov/attorneygeneral/
Kansas http://www.accesskansas.org/ksag/
Kentucky http://www.law.state.ky.us/
Louisiana http://www.ag.state.la.us/
Massachusetts http://www.ago.state.ma.us/
Maryland http://www.oag.state.md.us/
Maine http://www.state.me.us/ag/
Michigan http://www.michigan.gov/ag/
Minnesota http://www.ag.state.mn.us/
Missouri http://www.ago.state.mo.us/complant.htm
Mississippi http://www.ago.state.ms.us/divisions/consumer/consumer-protection.html
Montana http://www.doj.state.mt.us/
North Carolina http://www.jus.state.nc.us/
North Dakota http://www.ag.state.nd.us/
Nebraska http://www.ago.state.ne.us/
New Hampshire http://doj.nh.gov/
New Jersey http://www.state.nj.us/lps/
New Mexico http://www.ago.state.nm.us/
Nevada http://ag.state.nv.us/Divisions/Bcp/bcp.htm
New York http://www.oag.state.ny.us/consumer/consumer_issues.html
Ohio http://www2.ag.state.oh.us/sections/consumer/ccapsplus/terms.asp
Oklahoma http://www.oag.state.ok.us/
Oregon http://www.doj.state.or.us/
Pennsylvania http://www.attorneygeneral.gov/
Rhode Island http://www.riag.state.ri.us/
South Carolina http://www.scattorneygeneral.org/
South Dakota http://www.state.sd.us/attorney/office/contact.asp
Tennessee http://www.state.tn.us/consumer/
Texas http://www.oag.state.tx.us/
Utah http://attorneygeneral.utah.gov/
Virginia http://www.oag.state.va.us/
Vermont http://www.atg.state.vt.us/
Washington http://atg.wa.gov/
Wisconsin http://www.doj.state.wi.us/
West Virginia http://www.wvs.state.wv.us/wvag/
Wyoming http://attorneygeneral.state.wy.us/consumer.htm


[ Parent | Reply to This ]



Unbelievable[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#24)
by Anonymous User on Mon Dec 29, 2003 at 08:44:58 PM PDT

Never have I seen a company so dramatically toss their own reputation down the stairs. Not to mention their financial security.. this is going to cost them significantly more than cost-of-service for those units when the lawsuits hit. Sadly this might be a blow to the whole independent DVR industry (replay and tivo), while strengthening the appeal of products being produced by content providers for their own subscribers.

[ Reply to This ]


De-Activation[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#25)
by Anonymous User on Tue Dec 30, 2003 at 09:21:38 AM PDT

They've done another round of de-activations last night. (Mine wasn't plugged in to the net, so I'm still safe.)

Everybody, please, if your Replay gets de-activated, and they tell you on the phone they will only re-activate it if you pay them, or fax them a receipt showing a price of $400 or higher, take the time to file complaints with your state's Attorney Generals office.  Also file a complint with the CA state AG office since DNNA/ReplayTV is located in CA. Flooding the AG offices with complaints is the best solution we have to getting what Replay promised us.

Even if you are just going to return it, take a few minutes to file the complaints online first. If you bought it from CircuitCity, you have till 1/31/04 to return it under their holiday return policy.

Be sure to also file complaints with the FTC, (www.ftc.gov) and the BBB. (www.bbb.org)

[ Reply to This ]



Here's some interesting information...[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#37)
by Anonymous User on Mon Jan 05, 2004 at 02:46:01 PM PDT

Check out the bbb.org link below. http://www.bbbsilicon.org/common.html?location=/home/common/www/bindr/report.php&bureau=sanjose& amp;compid=211908 I'm glad I didn't buy one of these things. :)

[ Parent | Reply to This ]


Summary[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#26)
by Anonymous User on Tue Dec 30, 2003 at 12:04:34 PM PDT

Pretty good summary here:
http://talk.myoc.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=8486


[ Reply to This ]


Replay activates 3 units after contact from NBC[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#30)
by Anonymous User on Tue Dec 30, 2003 at 09:39:39 PM PDT

http://www.nbc10.com/consumeralert/2727298/detail.html

A company changes its policy just days before Christmas, leaving some consumers with a big bill.

Until a week before Christmas, Replay TV sold its units with a three-year subscription included in the purchase price.

Wilson, of Delaware County says:

"I bought three units for gifts. When I tried to hook one up, I was told the company had a new pricing structure and I would have to pay $300 to make it work."

"I already sent one unit to someone. How embarrassing it is to tell him that I only sent one third of the gift, he has to pay the other two-thirds to use it at all."

Replay TV tells us they alerted retailers in the middle of December that they were changing the way they charged for subscriptions.

They say not all retailers told their customers about the change.

After NBC 10 contacted the company, they have agreed to activate all three of the units Wilson bought and not charge the fee.

[ Reply to This ]



There's 4 groups to contact not 3[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#31)
by Anonymous User on Tue Dec 30, 2003 at 11:14:09 PM PDT

People above have said there are only 3 places you should contact as soon as you find out your unit is disabled or they ask you to subscribe.

1. FTC: http://www.ftc.gov/ftc/consumer.htm
   Click on "File a Complaint"

2. Your State's Attorney General:
   http://www.naag.org/ag/full_ag_table.php <---Full List of all Attorney Generals...including the US's non-state territories.

3. The Better Business Bureau Online:
   http://www.bbb.org
   Business Complaints: http://complaints.bbb.org/Welcome.asp

and
4. Your local media companies (TV and newspapers...even news radio might do some good)...they are trying to shift the blame to the retailers so their PR stays clean...they aren't doing a very good job as their PR is turning sour very quickly. Getting the media to apply some pressure should help make up their minds as well.

I found this story through [H]ard|OCP. I do not own a ReplayTV or a Tivo unit (though my Step-brother/roomate does have a Tivo/DirecTV unit). All boxes marked with the 3 years free service should honor that promise. It shouldn't be the customer who has to try to get the situation straightened out...it should be Replay TV activating the 3 year service and charging the retailer the 3 year service charge if the unit was not supposed to have that sticker/documentation.

There should be no cutoff date. Unless you are told differently by the retailer before you purchase the item, whatever it says on the box is what you should get, otherwise it's bait-and-switch. If you weren't told by the retailer about the new subscription policy then you have a perfect legal case against ReplayTV and the Retailer. Either way...you should get the 3 years free service...one of them will have to pay, not you.

[ Reply to This ]



ReplayTV customers furious over service charges[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#32)
by Markz2k on Wed Dec 31, 2003 at 07:49:58 PM PDT

AP article has hit many different news sites...

http://news.google.com/news?q=%27ReplayTV+customers+furious+over+service+charges%27&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&start=10&sa=N

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/business/7609763.htm

[ Reply to This ]



ReplayTV[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#33)
by Anonymous User on Fri Jan 02, 2004 at 08:57:36 AM PDT

i contacted: John Muscari +1-212-388-1400 ReplayTV's media/pr guy he said, "a press release will go out next wk and although I won't say in writing I can say the consumer will be pleased"

[ Parent | Reply to This ]


Too little too late ...[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#34)
by Anonymous User on Fri Jan 02, 2004 at 01:41:43 PM PDT

The damage is done. Anything that Replay does now is "too little, too late". Had they release something before the 27th of December, they may have stood a chance. Now all they'll get is litigation over "bait-and-switch" and "contract violation".

I, for one, will wait at least a year to see if they dig themselves out of this hole, but I'd still be leery of investing in their hardware. Once bitten, twice shy!

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Can I just step in here for a moment and say...[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#35)
by Anonymous User on Sat Jan 03, 2004 at 09:30:13 AM PDT

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!

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If you are too much of a pansy to...[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#36)
by Anonymous User on Sat Jan 03, 2004 at 07:04:06 PM PDT

stand up for yourself after getting ripped off, that's your problem. Don't make childish comments about those that aren't. Not everyone aspires to be a doormat.

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I smell a class action lawsuit...[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#38)
by SMEE on Tue Jan 06, 2004 at 06:53:45 AM PDT

Once more we have an idiot executive decision.

The sociologists even have a term for it. They call it "stratification displacement." That's when you've been "Da Man" for so long that you no longer understand the effects your decisions have on your peons or customers. I suppose we could call it the "Bill Gates" syndrome, but that would be, ah, mean-spirited. Of course, he can always hug his 1 billion dollars in cash he's taken for himself if he's feeling blue. Wish I had that option... At least money does what you tell it.

Anyway, this is a golden opportunity for our entrepreneurial plantiff's bar (i.e. lawyers that sue for profit--like the Tobacco parasites who have stated, publicly, that they intend to sue every industry in the US with the $20B they're getting for the Tobacco "settlement").

This time, however, a class action is clearly warranted. From what we know, they only likely inference is that this company clearly planned this bait-and-switch strategy--figuring people would pony up the bucks or, what the he double hockey sticks, it's the retailer's problem. The class should also include the retailers screwed out of profits by having to give refunds thru no fault of their own. The evidence leaves any other alternative extremely improbable.

I am positive that, right now, as I write this, some schyster somewhere is drawing up a class action suit as we speak...for once, it'll be justified....until the customers get coupons and the lawyers millions.

Let's face it: one way or another the consumer always pays for everything just as, in his guise as taxpayer, he pays for everything from necessary items, cruise missiles to studying cow farts.

It all comes from the same pocket: OURS!

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SEEKING NORTHERN CALIFORNIANS WHO BOUGHT THIS[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#39)
by CarrieKirby on Tue Jan 06, 2004 at 11:01:03 AM PDT

Hi, I'm a reporter for the San Francisco Chronicle. Today, ReplayTV released a statement saying that they will give 3 years of free service for those who were "confused" by the stickers or were told by call center agents that service was free. I'm looking for people who live in Northern California who bought the $150 box. What's your reaction to this news? Please email or call me asap. ckirby@sfchronicle.com, or 415-536-5130. thanks

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Replay TV[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#41)
by Anonymous User on Thu Jan 08, 2004 at 11:00:02 AM PDT

I bought a Replay TV 5040 about a year ago. I paid for the lifetime service activation. I bought this kind because it has Commercial Advance, a feature deleted on the 5500 models (why?). I also bought a second one as a gift for my brother last September. The lifetime fee was included in the sales price of the second unit (at the full price). However, I was eligible to receive a rebate of $50 (which I have yet to receive, by the way). When I bought the second unit, I seem to recall reading on their web site that ReplayTV was changing to the following price scheme: "The lifetime service option is no longer available. When you buy a Replay TV 5500 series, you get three years of activation included; after that, you must pay a monthly service fee of (I think it WAS $9.95)." In other words, they were discontinuing the lifetime option but were giving the three years' free with the purchase to mitigate that loss. From your commentary, it seems that THEY have now returned to the old pricing scheme. Why? I don't know, unless they had a lot of complaints. I will say this: If they had not offered BOTH the Commercial Advance feature AND the lifetime activation when I bought mine, I would have bought a Tivo instead. And that's the truth! I have another complaint about ReplayTV, however, and that's the way they can "upgrade" the software any time they feel like it ~ even to disabling features of the unit. I'm ever afraid that one of these days, the Commercial Advance will stop working.

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General public's first taste of DRM[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#42)
by Anonymous User on Tue Jan 20, 2004 at 02:29:25 PM PDT

This whole story smacks of the worst features of DRM and Product Activation combined together and taken to the extreme.

Whenever a purchased product (be it software or hardware) requires "permission" from the mother ship in order to be functional, this risk is incurred. It's like buying a car and having to get new keys from the dealer every month - sure, the system "works", but you lose a lot of control over your use of the product.

Things are bad enough with plain old product activation schemes, which may or may not be available later when needed (aka Quickbooks sunsetting products); add the ability of the company to use DRM to "rescind" previously granted permissions whenever they want and you've got a real monster to tame.

ReplayTV and its subscription service is akin to "software" (or hardware, depending on how you look at it) that relies on both product activation (you can buy it for $149 but it won't be useful until you activate it) and DRM (be sure to subscribe for $12.95 a month after that or it won't work) to ensure a constant revenue stream. Even purchasers of the $300 "lifetime" service could easily find out that their definition of "lifetime" may be quite different from that of D&M Holdings (could a "lifetime subscription" really mean just for the lifetime of the company?).

Any time a product won't work without constantly calling home you can have this problem - many of us have already experienced this with software, digital music, and even computer hardware (Cisco routers anyone?). ReplayTV just brought the whole issue to the forefront of the average consumer's consciousness.

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Recent Purchase[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#43)
by Anonymous User on Tue Jan 27, 2004 at 07:21:26 PM PDT

I got ripped myself. i researched their web site, found they had a deal searched local stores, and found one at CompUSA. It had the green label and the insert in the box talking about the 3 years service. I bought it on the 1/24/2004! Are these stores really making this big of a mistake? I doubt it.

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Three Words: Get A Tivo.[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#44)
by Anonymous User on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 03:12:40 PM PDT

I've been a fan of DVR (specifically, TiVo) for over 3 years now. When I made my original purchase, I signed up for the "lifetime" service, and haven't looked back.

When the factory warranty ran out, I jumped on the AVS forum and pulled down instructions for self-upgrading it (I'm an IT pro, so it was trivial).

I have always considered Replay to be an "also ran" in this market, and the foolishness disclosed here gives legitimacy to that opinion.

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Replay TV warranty vs. reality[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#45)
by Anonymous User on Tue Feb 10, 2004 at 07:01:51 PM PDT

I have a ReplayTV 5000 series. The hard drive failed. (Oddly, the hard drive also failed on my earlier ReplayTV 3000 series -- what are the odds?)

ReplayTV said "send it in for warranty replacement". I rushed it to their depot in Texas, only to discover that it sat there for almost ONE MONTH! When I called to inquire, it took them 20 minutes to locate info on my unit.

Then they said they didn't have a replacement to send! I said that all I needed was a new hard drive, not a replacement system. But apparently they only do replacement, not repair. The really bad part: They only replace when another unit "becomes available", and they had no prediction of when this might be.

They told me this with a straight face, like it's OK to tie their warranty service to the failure rate of the systems! Imagine a restaurant where your meal is ready, but you can't eat it until another diner finishes so the restaurant can recycle the tableware to you!

The replacement unit finally showed up. But unlike the system I returned, which had lifetime activation, the replacement had NO ACTIVATION! When I called in, the support person required that I provide the serial number of the original unit, which I no longer had in my possession!! None of the ReplayTV paperwork had this number (though I purchased it directly from them), but fortunately I'd written it in the manual when I received the original machine.

Keeping in mind that I bought the original unit directly from ReplayTV, and they provided the warranty replacement, what kind of nonsense is this? Why wouldn't they provide the service their own records indicate I should have? What would have happened if I did NOT have the number -- the most likely scenario? Why is it my responsibility to prove what they sold me?!? Failing this, I'd have a doorstop, apparently.

A recent news story says ReplayTV's new owner doesn't want the low-end DVR market, and is targeting the deep-pocket tech fans who will spend for premium gear. PREMIUM GEAR is an oxymoron when it comes with the kind of business practices ReplayTV has dumped on its existing customers.

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Replay TV[ Parent | Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#46)
by Anonymous User on Wed Feb 11, 2004 at 07:12:58 AM PDT

I wrote earlier about my experience with Replay TV, the 5000 series, and the lifetime subscription. I already owned one of these, bought from Replay TV. I bought the 5000 model mainly because it has Commercial Advance ~ a feature they have dropped, to my chagrin (although I don't know why ~ probably under pressure from advertisers). Mine has worked fine, except for a period last summer when they pushed a new version of software that caused it not to be able to connect again. That incident took about a dozen calls and a total reset to resolve and left a bad feeling for Replay TV with me. At any rate, I bought another one for my brother, same model, same reason. The lifetime activation was included on my brother's unit, also. When my brother unpacked his unit, the POWER indicator did not work. I called Replay TV, and they gave me a RMA and said to send the unit to Irving, Texas. Since I live in Garland, Texas, I said I would deliver it there. The man on the telephone was very nice and assured me that the lifetime subscription would be transferred to the replacement unit. Needless to say, it wasn't. I had to call back and get them to transfer the activation. The girl I talked to at first tried to tell me it wasn't possible to transfer the service, but she backed down after I told her the whole story. It wasn't hassle-free, but they did transfer it. However, I believe that they could have done this automatically, since the broken unit had not even been used. My "new" unit was replaced with a "refurbished" one. They probably had my unit repaired, and that may be the unit you got. I probably got somebody else's unit, and so on.

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drugs no prescription [ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#88)
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carecenter[ Reply to This ] (none / 0) (#102)
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